SELLING SPOKE CARDS? WTF
Thread started by
barleye at 07.2.10 - 8:29 am
What's with this disturbing trend of ride leaders selling spoke cards to the riders?
I know they cost money to make but IMO that comes with the responsibity of hosting a ride. I get 100 sheets of 5mm for $20 at laminationdepot.com and each RWNN costs me less than $10 for 200 cards.
I'm not trying to single out anybody... If the ride leaders until now didn't know about the place above, they do now.
You do the math...if the leaders REALLY need to re coupe their money...how much should they realistically charge?
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Welcome to America
I think monthly rides shouldn't charge at all , just my opinion..
Weekly rides are another story, that takes a lot of time, thought, and a little bit of money... To that I say, go for it... I know an old weekly ride that started charging halfway through their stint of rides and there were no qualms. That person deserved a little cash per card because they were outputting material every week and the cards were QUALITY in both design and material.
On the flipside, I saw a ride trying to charge for the worst card I've ever seen. Bad cuts, unoriginal design and cheap lamination. That was a joke. Nobody bought the cards.
Personally, I like giving and getting spoke cards for free. I value them more that way for some reason. More personal
Thanks for the tip on the cheaper cards Barleye. I usually go to Staples and they charge about $10 to make 36 cards.
RickDarge07.2.10 - 8:39 am
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No one forces you to buy them, I don't think they have any value unless you assign value to them. My point being that the buyers and sellers deserve each other.
Me, I have given away 1000's of spoke cards at my events and will continue to do so.
rev106 responding to a
comment by RickDarge
07.2.10 - 10:33 am
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Bicykillers has a few very limited edition spoke cards made out of solid gold. I didn't charge a dime. Same with stickers. Hand screen printed and paid for with my own money... the people really appreciate it and it gives them value... like a Michael Jordan White Sox rookie card.
BICYKILLER responding to a
comment by RickDarge
07.2.10 - 10:56 am
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You don't think people should charge for spoke cards, but what does it matter if people do?
These have been hot commodities since the first day they showed up wedged into wheels on Los Angeles' first big social rides. It is inevitable that these ephemeral bits of culture have a value attached to them. Exchanging them for cash is only natural.
Attn Printers and Printmakers: offer a custom spoke card service for more formal rides.
Commoditizing an artifact of a subculture is what we're best at here in L.A. I wouldn't be surprised if big corporations and auto makers jumped into the act and started sponsoring rides and events, and used this schwag to sell themselves and their crap.
ubrayj0207.2.10 - 11:05 am
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Ha! My next spoke card will have one side with the simple message, "Your Ad Here".
Creative Thing responding to a
comment by ubrayj02
07.2.10 - 11:07 am
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I can't wait for the new Acura spoke cards to come out.
Mook07.2.10 - 11:11 am
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I turn money down from people .... and thanks for the tip on the 100 sheets for 10 bucks ... when I was making 30 a week it was cool ... now Im making 60 .. so this is helpful ...
OsnapsonJC07.2.10 - 3:57 pm
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What's the big deal?
Most people expect bike rides to be free, spend $5, $10, $20+ on food, beverages and other comforts in a night, and not think twice about all the time and money somebody put in to the organization of the ride.
Not everybody can afford to subsidize the takers of the bike scene who never give back. Some people spend their time organizing rides when they could be out hustling money.
I personally enjoy designing, making, and sharing spokecards, and I don't mind paying for them from time to time.
But I've got nothing against people selling them.
And I wouldn't hesitate to pay for one if I liked it enough.
I know that its not just the spoke-card (usually priced at $1) that is really being paid for. The money goes back into the ride. Even if that means that the ride organizer has a little lunch money when they are out researching the next route.
I remember CRANK MOB was selling spoke cards & had a deal with the hot dog guy to break of CM a %age of sales. It just meant that they could be that much more ambitious when putting on parties and entertainment, for all the ridazz who got to party for free.
Last year we had a small handful of ridazz put up $400+ of their own money, so the All City Toy Ride could have a place to party, and cover from the rain.
It worked great and I have no complains.
But wouldn't it be more sustainable to get $1 or $2 from each ridaa to copver expenses, than to have to rely on a handful of big doners?
Are a ride organizer's limits the limits of their own pocketbook?
trickmilla07.3.10 - 1:08 pm
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I've been on rides but have no spoke cards. Actually, I always wondered if the ride organizers were going out of pocket on spoke cards or if they were recouping the cost some how. If it's a good design and a good ride, I'd be willing to put forth a dollar or two to the spoke card (and the hard work of the organizer). Ride organizers/leaders are a pretty dedicated bunch--planning and leading their rides without fail every month/week/whatever. It takes a lot of dedication to commit yourself to a weekly or month ride; if I enjoy myself on the ride, I wouldn't mind "thanking" them...
To second urbayj thoughts, you don't have to pay for it if you don't want it.
danceralamode07.3.10 - 1:29 pm
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It's fucking tacky as all hell to sell spoke cards...obviously a few of you disagree... in my opinion every ride should have a spoke card.
... they don't have to be super fancy. As i said in my original post if the leader HAS To recoup his money...Realistically how much should they charge? On each rwnn do you think it would be fair for me to sell 200 cards at a dollar each? I would profit $190...
Now are you hippies seeing the bigger picture?
I think selling them is fine for charitable event.. or to pay a band to perform..
barleye07.3.10 - 2:05 pm
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Let me rephrase something i just wrote... if i spoke card is being sold to pay for a band or something else on the ride it should be listed in the ride listing beforehand.. a ride leader should never profit from his or her rides. The mom ridaz,, nathan and sean, Rev, and lots of others no that it's for the art and design that matters most. Not the profit.
barleye07.3.10 - 2:14 pm
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*know...not no
Stupid smart phone
barleye07.3.10 - 2:15 pm
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I for one will NEVER sell a spoke card on a ride.
SnapperS07.3.10 - 2:47 pm
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I have some vintage MR spoke cards for $20.00 each
perfect accessory for the newbe hipster.
Dedicated818 responding to a
comment by GermanguyfromtheEast
07.3.10 - 3:03 pm
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What is important to me, is that people are motivated to put on fun and compelling bike rides that get more people riding bikes for fun(ction).
There is tradition and culture to this movement but there are no rules.
Each independent ride promoter has to make their own decisions about how they are going to do things.
Personally, while I love to be handed a beautiful spokecard. I never expect it. I never even seek them out, unless I see one and it completely wows me.
What is a 1000 times more important to me than any spoke card is the quality of the ride. The vibe of the group, the pace, the route, the revelations etc.
Nobody is owed a spokecard. Those who just expect them for showing up are already missing the point.
trickmilla responding to a
comment by barleye
07.3.10 - 3:36 pm
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Patrick i think you totally missed the point of what i was trying to say...my point with this thread was to convey that i think it's rude greedy and obnoxious to sell spoke cards for a ride... your opinion won't change and i respect that... at the very least respond to my question about selling 200 cards at a buck each.. i think all of us can agree that it would be wrong to charge and walk away with a profit.. nobody has answered either about how much realistically a card should cost a rider.
barleye responding to a
comment by trickmilla
07.3.10 - 3:59 pm
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STEAL THIS SPOKECARD!
MAXX07.3.10 - 4:44 pm
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"fucking tacky"? not to name names, but some ridazz do tacky fucking things all the time like go on rides to cheat on their girlfriends, take rides to fucked up parts of the city that are obviously going to be dangerous to the group, have fund raisers for charity events that don't even respect the style and/or mission of MR, etc.
I think the first time I ever bought a spoke card was on the Pillow Fight II ride for 2 bucks in August of 2008, it was a quality piece of art that I was happy to donate some money for, I ended up buying 3 of them. Many ridazz offer things they make for sale, such grilled cheese sandwiches or food, pendants or jewelry, used bikes and parts, t-shirts and clothing, a door cover at party, etc. I am glad that these things exist in the bike community and that some people who need it are re-couping a little spare change for the time and effort they put into these events that I love (but I am sure that most of the money just goes back into beer, lol). Most of us are not high paid lawyers or accountants that have unlimited resources to spend on whatever they feel like at the time, I believe that most of us do want we can with the limited funds we have or raise on the rides.
I am sure it's nice to be able to spend $10 bucks to make 200 spoke cards to give away, but that's really not a reality for some people since not everyone has their own laminating machine, high density color printer (so that spoke cards don't fade in the sunlight - a fact that happened to me in my first 40 weeks of making cards, now I do all my printing at Staples for around $1.20 per 8x10 sheet, then add in the lamination cost of $1.59 per 8x10 sheet.- not even mentioning the time and effort to create the design) and other such supplies needed to create long lasting spoke cards.
Why would you have issues with people raising money for their rides by selling spoke cards for spare change, and not have issues about paying for a band or donating to charity that you don't even know where the money really goes? Some of your opinions really don't make sense to me, but you are welcome to them :)
I will still be happy to donate money to MR sound systems to be used and shared on many different rides, buy spoke cards, food, and art created by ridazz when I can afford it and will do what I can to help the bike community continue moving forward.
So now I hope you can understand why some rides charge a few bucks for spoke cards on their rides ;)
Sincerely,
XL
X-Large responding to a
comment by barleye
07.3.10 - 6:25 pm
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When it's a nice design like that I'll always pay if that's what they want.
My only excuse would be the plenty of times I have no hard currency on me.
Of all the technology I have not become a slave to, the debit card holds the whip.
Anywho, once your wheel is jam-packed and there's no reasonable room, time to cut back until you've gotten yourself one of those old school, family album thingies.
bentstrider responding to a
comment by X-Large
07.3.10 - 7:45 pm
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Bike sceensters ride heavy load.
Los Angeles: The local bicycle counter-culture has become so strong in the past few years many riders are now dealing with a new problem: Gratuitous spoke cards.
“I can barley get my bike up a curb now.” Said one local rider who wished to be unnamed. “I have so many spoke cards stuck in my wheels now that they weigh a good ten pounds heavier than the bike did before I started going to group rides.” Many group rides, the participants are given a spoke card; a laminated pieces of paper with a design or logo about the ride by the ride organizers. With several rides going on a week it has become a problem for local cyclists who can only fit so many spoke cards in their spokes. “I tried to get them all in there but at some point they all start falling out on the ride, spoke cards everywhere.” Amanda, 23 stated that because of this she has chosen to not use them anymore. “I don’t want to piss anyone off, so I take them and just keep them at home in an old shoebox.” During stops many of the trick riders have suffered the pitfalls of too many spokecards. “I was doing some barspins and my back tire slipped on a spokecard and I fell off my bike.” Stated Juan, 19 during one of the many nighttime bicycle rides that go on through out the city. “It’s too much man, what do you do with all these thing once it’s over?” In addition to run-ins with the LAPD, this is one of the many problems facing LA bike culture during it’s growth.
See what happens? Too many!
rev106 responding to a
comment by bentstrider
07.3.10 - 10:26 pm
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The resistance from a crosswind inflicted on a sail of spokecards is what I'd be more concerned about, especially in the HD.
bentstrider responding to a
comment by rev106
07.4.10 - 12:42 am
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crosswinds + spoke cards are no joke. i remember many months ago on a LACM ride and it was very windy and people were getting blown around. i only had one spoke card and i noticed a night and day difference as soon as i took it off.
tfunk40807.4.10 - 1:27 am
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OT but sorta on topic: where can i make stickers at? and i don't mean cut-out vinyl decals of just letters/fonts. tia.
tfunk40807.4.10 - 1:29 am
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tfunk408 hit me up adrian_g85@yahoo.com
i'm assuming you want vinyl stickers right? i can hook you up.
i have examples of past jobs.
AIDS66 responding to a
comment by tfunk408
07.4.10 - 1:32 am
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I see i went a bit overboard saying it was rude and obnoxious and tacky... this is just my suggestion... try your best to keep them free.y That's all. Sorry if i offended anyone. It wasn't my intention.
barleye07.4.10 - 7:07 am
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She's the bomb:
http://www.angrygirl.org/
rev106 responding to a
comment by tfunk408
07.4.10 - 7:08 am
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barleye,
i wouldnt have been able to pay for making all of those snazzy spoke cards if you hadn't come through with the printer and laminator.
i also know that XL has spent a LOT of money on Taco Tuesdays, buying tacos for EVERY rida, making 3D-spoke cards and other awesome things EVERY WEEK! for this he started charging a $1 tax on spoke cards. but that's just one ride.
I think the second friday ride should always have free spoke cards. some things should never cost money.
tortuga_veloce07.4.10 - 7:34 am
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I think it has really got out of hand.
The last ride I went on, I was eager to get my hands on some spoke cards for my friends and I. So, i asked around, and ended up buying a few spoke cards for the evening and the ride home. But as the ride started to move along and the night progressed, my friends and realized we were sold some bunk cards. They just didn't slice well through the night air. As it turned out, they were made from 110lb paper, without UV finish, and the color correction and margins were really off, let alone we could tell these were knock-offs because they were for "THE RIDE WITH KNOW NAME"
I'm just saying very be careful what you're buying. Also, another lesson learned: dont eat your spoke cards!!
md207.4.10 - 8:36 am
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wow... i thought myself to be a little lame for checking the site on sunday morning.... but to post this gif to other members ride threads... I don't know... that kind of sucks...
whatever, CBC is today... enjoy your 4th everyone
md2 responding to a
comment by tortuga_veloce
07.4.10 - 8:45 am
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tIan, he sax thing is kind of a dick move.
it doesn't suit you well.
-------------------------------------------
Barleye,
I understand where you are coming from
and, in general, I do agree that is is great to keep the punk diy attitude happening around here. especially for Midnight Ridazz rides.
But in the end, each new ride had to decide for themselves how they are gonna do things, and we should let people be free to figure out what works for them. We already have MR, we already have critical mass, every ride does not need to be a "community" ride.
Actually its healthier all around for people to decide for themselves how much to give away in a ride and how much to sell.
I think the analogy of a band is great.
It's great to have a band that is willing to do free shows, give away music, tee-shirts, and donate their time and art to the community. At they same time bands often benifit from friends who help with sound, art, pictures, promotion, etc.
Who's to say when is the right time to start charging for shows? Charging for CDs? Selling merch, etc. its up to the artists to decide. If they have fancy jobs they may never need to "sell out" if they want to dedicate their lives to being artists, they have to make a decision at some point how to commodity their work.
trickmilla responding to a
comment by tortuga_veloce
07.4.10 - 10:46 am
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honestly i overheard something a few rides ago that kind of changed my mind about the whole spoke card thing. i was on taco Tuesday i forgot what number but it was the 90210 ride and i overheard "XL" bragging about how much money he makes off the cards and how much it costs him. (at the fountain before going up Wilshire) i know have a different view of him and what his ride is all about. serious 2$ for something that costs you cents to make?? thats just being a cheap asshole. i know time and a few dollars out of your pocket go to making them but come the fuck on! i can understand 1 dollar a pop to cover time and the up front cost of making them. don't go around bragging about how much you make them for and how stupid people are for buying them on the ride.
jackxxx07.15.10 - 5:06 pm
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it's only a dollar.
i proudly buy spoke cards from Taco Tuesday.
It pays for my fire soccer.
goosegoose07.15.10 - 5:13 pm
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SUCH BULLSHIT - YOUR NAME SAYS IT ALL - JACKASS
PS - YOU AREN'T REAL
jackxxx
Member since: 07.15.10
Topics: 0
Replies: 1
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X-Large responding to a
comment by jackxxx
07.15.10 - 7:17 pm
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Yeah ... I cant even imagine you saying anything like that ... such bullshit ... .
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by X-Large
07.15.10 - 7:51 pm
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you're not real!
fireballs FTW
666 responding to a
comment by jackxxx
07.15.10 - 8:02 pm
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Are you kidding me? Have you been to XLs house? Dude is rolling in the dough, all from that spoke card money! He has crazy relaxation devices, leopard skin sofas, snake skin drink coasters, midget butlers, all that shit!
buckchin responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
07.15.10 - 8:02 pm
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yeah but you had to buy the fucking pack of cards...they didn't just give them out free.What about the kid who collects them like Poke'mon card .Comes to the ride causes trouble,and leaves 20 min into the ride.All because he can't keep up,all for a spokecard.Motorcycle clubs,car clubs and yes even some cycling clubs charge dues.This money is put towards events etc...don't be so cheap people.
PNUTS responding to a
comment by BICYKILLER
07.28.10 - 4:26 am
reply
Word!!!Man the first spoke card I paid for was a Taco Tuesday Holloween UJI Board!!!DOPE!!!I even told XL "Keep the change"...
PNUTS responding to a
comment by goosegoose
07.28.10 - 4:32 am
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Think what you want about selling spokecards but it's pretty much a given that commodization and capitalization of a subculture kills the subculture. The visionaries leave moving on to something fresher and still outside of the mainstream, and what's left along with a few of the now jaded early leaders are the uncreative people who think they can buy into a subculture rather than creating it. The ratio of fun to boring poseurdom drops precipitously.
Hagbard Celine07.28.10 - 12:14 pm
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Ridazz Roulette!
Guess What dude,