LA Critical Crap
Thread started by
cyclepaths at 09.25.10 - 12:45 am
yes it sucked, and i think its dead. It was one hour into the ride when people started to leave and cops started giving out tickets.Its over. RIP CriticalMass
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don't be a salmon or run reds and you won't get tickets. ride was more fun when people started to peel off anyway.
tchap09.25.10 - 12:53 am
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i had a good time really. seeing cops on Bikes imo is better then having them yell at us through loud speakers. not to mention they are still people coming in to the bike community. i brought 3 people i know tonight and we all had a good time. listen to the rules and you dont need to worry about anything... its not hard.
nug09.25.10 - 1:02 am
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Big ups to LAPD and LACM (for those people that know how to follow their "sense")!!
Even though it was bizarre, you gotta be grateful for the effort those people tried to teach you to ride in a group.
^olsko*jr709.25.10 - 1:16 am
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RIP LACM!!!!!
those grown ups that were controling the ride can suck my dick!!!!
so can all the pigs busting people for stupid shit!!!
u will heard about it tomorow.
u guys sucked the life out of this ride!!!
fixie4life09.25.10 - 1:24 am
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I saw a small LACM tonight on holywood blvd. but hey they were all stopping at red lights and staying to the right.Smaller=Smarter i guess.
Huey55509.25.10 - 1:44 am
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Probably the group I was in. We made our own People's ride since it looked like there wasn't one organized before hand.
Just a nice lil' stroll to Hollywood. Checkin' out the candy and what not.
^olsko*jr7 responding to a
comment by Huey555
09.25.10 - 1:50 am
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This was my first cm, I enjoyed it. I tried the crank mob last week. the attitudes of police and riders not the same on this ride. The fact the poo po where riding with us was a plus. Those I saw getting tickets almost alway cross the middle line and ignored insturctions to move to the right. thanks again to those who organized and the police.
twinns2boy109.25.10 - 2:00 am
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I wasn't planning to go to LACM, but I joined up with the ride when I heard them shouting and whistling down the block from my house. We rode maybe four miles in an hour. When it became clear that the cornfield stop was going to last forever, I left to go do more productive things.
I actually had a pretty good time though, probably because my expectations were so very, very low.
nathansnider09.25.10 - 2:09 am
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THought it was cool. Had more fun on the smaller breakaway groups. Cops seemed cool at first , then dicked out later on. Id give the ride a B minus.
shotgun_mike09.25.10 - 2:13 am
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It was fun. Met lots of girls. Riding slow allows you to talk to girls.
But if you don't want to meet girls, you can do the other rides that have all guys.
328rides4ever09.25.10 - 2:15 am
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I stopped doing LACM altogether. It's too slow, too many stupid unexperienced riders with no common sense, posers, high school kids asking me for weed. It's not dead, it's BEEN dead.
numero diez09.25.10 - 2:18 am
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Dang, I couldn't make it out for the ride tonight. Looking forward to next month already though (pre-Halloween ride!). Anyone got any idea what the turnout was tonight? What were the stops?
Hallucin809.25.10 - 2:26 am
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15 WILL GET YOU 20!!!
Xray responding to a
comment by 328rides4ever
09.25.10 - 6:24 am
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Most of the guys here don't like girls.
sgrant responding to a
comment by 328rides4ever
09.25.10 - 7:49 am
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That's why you start dropping random questions like "what year did you graduate HS?", or "you remember back in blah, when that one dude committed blah over in blah?"
bentstrider responding to a
comment by Xray
09.25.10 - 8:12 am
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More girls on the ride will come if they feel safe. I brought a newbie girl and she feel in love with lacm. She felt safe with all the cops and she love all the positive vibes coming for the communitu. All the guys here are always crying that there isn't enough chicks on the ride. Last night felt like copenhagen or amsterdam. Rules etc... help grow this bike movement in l.a.
Sorry cycle-p. Things change.
Stay positive and make your own ride. You're sure to get the ride you want when you're leading it.
el sabroso09.25.10 - 8:14 am
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my 2 cents ..... The ride had its ups and downs ..... Im going to be honest in saying at some points I kinda felt like an elephant being led to the circus ...... Some of the officers act like they are RoboCop and others are talking and actually engaging people in conversation instead of thinking of it as a job ......
OsnapsonJC09.25.10 - 10:36 am
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I noticed that the ones riding their bikes were way more laid back than the ones riding in the squad cars...
I'm telling you guys,Biking is a great stress reliever.
Ninja biker responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
09.25.10 - 10:45 am
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unless you ride a shitty bike and need repairs a lot, then its just a nightmare LOL!
Aktive_420 responding to a
comment by Ninja biker
09.25.10 - 10:57 am
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cyclepath, on the last friday of the month on Dec 28th 08 ... it was 42 degrees and there were maybe 50 ridazz. that night was a hustle ride just to keep warm ... it was alive then and its alive now
long live CM
Migcycle09.25.10 - 11:04 am
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well said osnap,
pretty much my experience.
Me and my friends left the cornfield for tacos and a pit stop.
2 hours later we hit the road and saw so so many groups of cyclists all along Sunset going either direction. It was kind of nice to be riding in the aftermath.
trickmilla responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
09.25.10 - 11:05 am
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Yeah, that's a training and hiring issue. Some of the cops were real cool. Some were kind of "just doing their job". As taxpayers we need to pressure the city to not just hire more cops, but to hire good cops, people who really want to serve the public. Let's face it, police work is customer service. We as taxpayers are the customer. Sgt Krumer and the higher ranking police commanders who were there, get that. We need to have good cops from top to bottom, not just at the top. I am glad they promote the good cops to higher positions. Unfortunately it leaves the ones who aren't promoted to kind of "just do their job and collect a paycheck."
328rides4ever responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
09.25.10 - 11:05 am
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unless you ride a shitty bike and need repairs a lot, then its just a nightmare LOL!
Aktive_420
No way dood
Have u seen krumer's bike?
Fully accessorized Giant :D
Also I saw a pick up truck with some of the bikes loaded in the back
So even if they did break down they can just call it in.
hmmm we should set up something like that.
AAA for bicyclists ;)
Ninja biker responding to a
comment by Aktive_420
09.25.10 - 11:12 am
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a few years back , the city and acura set up L.A. Bike Tour. Thousands of riders, Some of the local bike shops had truck following the route to help with bike problems.
Might consider talking to some shops , see if they would be interested in LACM. Good to help them gain some future customers.
twinns2boy1 responding to a
comment by Ninja biker
09.25.10 - 12:37 pm
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Please support your statements with a valid arguement
palucha6609.25.10 - 6:28 pm
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I back my statements up with acquisition rights and a fruit-basket.
bentstrider responding to a
comment by palucha66
09.25.10 - 6:36 pm
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Is that the one where we went to Hancock Park? If so I remember that one, it was cold as shit.
buckchin responding to a
comment by Migcycle
09.25.10 - 6:56 pm
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Hello All,
I have been reading your criticisms and comments about the ride and want you to know I hear and understand what your issues are with regards to the confusion created by inconsistant corking by officers.
Please allow me to explain. In the past, many riders have complained about our motors or cars zipping by you at high speeds in an effort to leapfrog to the next light in order to cork. Riders have suggested that it is dangerous and intimidating. We tried to avoid this but as a result we can not get to every intersection to cork. Additionally, we do not have sufficient officers to crok every light.
Since we can not cork all we are asking for riders to stop at all reds. This has the effect of splitting the ride into many smaller rides. Also it stretches the ride out over a larger area and increases the LACM footprint (not necessarily a bad thing if the goal is to be noticed).
Some of the other things I am hearing is that a lot of folks split after the cornfield because the park was closed, there was no water or store that you could get water at. Also I do not think we need to discuss Union steet as we can all agree that it was not a street that was condusive to riding as a large event.
FInally...LACM has outgrown Wilshire and Western and quite frankly a new place should be selected that can accomodate the number of folks turning out.
My suugestions mirror Aktive's to some degree. Develop a route. With a route you can avoid bad street selection, plan your stops in places where you can refill (and confirm they are open) and have a significantly smaller contingent of officers pre-deploy and possiibly cork your ride consistantly as we move along.
There are some who say that LACM traditionally has no leader and no route. While tradition can be a good thing, tradition itself is no reason to hold on to a practice that does not serve (and in fact hinders) the greater efforts to promote cycling and call awareness to cyclists in the City.
The truth of the matter is the same core group of people steer the ride every month...
they take a leadership role without proclaiming themselves leaders. I think we have demonstrated the LAPD wants to work with you and not against...you can step out of the shadows.
Thanks all!
Sgt. David Krumer
Sgt. David Krumer09.26.10 - 12:56 pm
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good words sgt K
glad we all have this open discussion back n forth amongst ridaz.
ridaz to police.
police to media
media to the world
world back to ridaz
LETS KEEP ON WORKING
keep me posted sgt!
Aktive_420 responding to a
comment by Sgt. David Krumer
09.26.10 - 1:01 pm
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Don't start crying over this, if you don't like the way it's going, start your own ride. It may not be as spontaneous and fun, but a few years from now, if you start riding every day of the week to get to work, you'll want to be safe more than anything else. I for one, would rather have cycling be mainstream than be this thrilling flip of the dice. I'm sick of close calls.
I want 10,000+ people on critical mass, by any means necessary. With or without police escort, I could care less. I want all the rich and poor, in shape and out of shape motherfuckers riding bikes. Riding a bike will always be fun regardless, I'm not so sure why folks are so goddamn sad over LACM changing shape.
LACM is far from dead, it's turning into something new. It's a huge ride, and I think LAPD is starting to understand how tough it really is to control these rides, keep everyone safe, while not making threatening gestures towards riders. Yeah, they get up in your face every once in a while for crossing the double yellow line, so umm, don't cross the double yellow line.
More police officers on bikes riding alongside us, that is simply awesome. Not even for San Francisco CM do they have this many officers riding alongside the mass, it's usually only motorcycles and cruisers. We've come a long way in this town. Maybe next time you get in a scrape with a motorist, and the police gets called in, they'll take your side this time around. Imagine that! As long as we don't act like chumps, we'll eventually get our respect from LAPD.
jericho1ne responding to a
comment by ScooterHayes
09.26.10 - 6:02 pm
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GREAT RESPONSE BRO.
THANKS FOR SUPPORTING THE EVER EVOLVING CM
Aktive_420 responding to a
comment by jericho1ne
09.26.10 - 6:18 pm
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Recently Ive enjoyed Critical Mass due to the LAPD joining us. But damn, sometimes I feel like punching idiots that whipskid, cut me off, etc etc. Like Osnap told me yesterday, "there were moments where it was just me vs the mass"
palucha6609.26.10 - 6:19 pm
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I want to wright something extremely negative... but int the interest of keeping things positive Im going to keep my comments to myself ... but... I will take your advise and start another ride on the last Friday of the month ....
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by jericho1ne
09.26.10 - 6:20 pm
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yup im with palucha.. let your voice be heard brotha!..
Aktive_420 responding to a
comment by palucha66
09.26.10 - 6:28 pm
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Its nothing against the LAPD or people helping the ride... Palucha knows what Im going to say .. so why he said that is a little perplexing....
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Aktive_420
09.26.10 - 6:44 pm
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Next up we should print out what HOLD YOUR LINE means ;)
Ninja biker09.26.10 - 7:00 pm
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Boooooooooooooooo.
MR as a whole is terrible. Same old assholes drinking, smoking, acting like
the world gives a fuck about them.
I ride one ride because it's fun, fast, and adventurous. Not a "let's sit around with our tall boys and get high with my hipster buddies and 1 hipster girl we are all trying to fuck." But to each his own.
All things become predictable. I really wish I hadn't become a cynic but after over 30+ rides over the past 2 years, I feel like things have tanked for ME. I don't know how some of you do it, perhaps very little social life outside of MR.
I'm adios.
ScooterHayes09.26.10 - 10:32 pm
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It is absolutely SILLY to say Critical Mass is "dead". Maybe if your forst critical mass was this year, maybe if you don't know that critical mass has been going for almost 20 years, surviving attempts at govermnent control on every major continent.
Then yea... I could see how you might throw up your hands after a CM where LAPD chose to get more involved, and say its the end of the world.... but after 10s of thousands Critical Mass rides the world over, many survining much more challenging circumstances ... history revals the little struggles and experiments we are dealing with now as a tiny blip of activity in a global movement that will be with us well into the 21st century.
trickmilla09.26.10 - 10:42 pm
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The lack of leadership and lack of route that CM employs is more than "tradition" it is a structure that is frankly designed to prevent Critical Mass from being co-opted by corperations, political interests, and governments.
The structure of this ride deliberately designed to complicate attempts (no matter how well intentioned) to co-opt the ride.
I'm not a purest by any means,
But I do belive that the fundamental structure of critical mass, for all its complications, does serve a valuable function. I understand it makes your job more complicated, but frankly, it is supposed to.
I would love to see LA Critical Mass retain its essential structure and spirit, yet figure out how to explore some new possibilities.
New, rotating, start points would be exciting. Multiple rides, convergence points, etc.
The possibilites are endless. But respecting the core structure of critical mass is essential for many of us.
If LACM was to change to more closely resemble LAPDs vision of what the ride should be, I can promise that many of us would start a more traditional critical mass(es) to ride on instead.
trickmilla responding to a
comment by Sgt. David Krumer
09.26.10 - 11:18 pm
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LACM is asolutely dead!!! its time to call it some thing else cas its not CM. I think its shold be called the bike ride sponsered by LAPD or the LAPDCM? maybe we can get different sponsers like maybe Honda or Fox?
RIP LACM
fixie4life09.26.10 - 11:23 pm
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All things become predictable. I really wish I hadn't become a cynic, but after 30+ rides over the past two years, I feel like things have tanked for ME. I don't know how some of you do it, perhaps very little social life outside of MR.
When you're close enough to get to the rides in a timely manner to the point where it's basically on your "things I could probably do tonight list", I see where you're coming from.
Things become not so fresh anymore and it gets to the point where it's either "up the ante", or "I'm busting outta this gip joint".
Take a break, find something else that fulfills the void and ask yourself if you're satisfied yet.
As far as having "no social life outside of MR", perhaps that void is only there for some of us due to the monetary requirements of engaging in other circles.
To me, MR in general is a cool way to have a good time without really thinking about cash flow all that much.
bentstrider responding to a
comment by ScooterHayes
09.27.10 - 12:16 am
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There is an idiotic myopia that has gripped many long-time Critical Mass riders. The idea of Critical Mass, I believe, was to allow cycling to become a legitimate form of transportation, to provoke a change in the way bicycling is perceived.
Now that mainstream society is trying to find a way to legitimize cycling, a way to bring the act into the fold of normal life, you guys are whining like a bunch of spoiled children.
Having a night-time CicLAvia once a month is an immense thing. It may not be the Critical Mass of yesteryear, but we don't live in yesteryear - we live now. Right now, the mayor of LA, the chief of police, and numerous politicians are lined up in support of cycling. Right now, tens of millions are set to flood into bike projects and infrastructure. People are looking around for solutions to global warming, a fragile non-productive, sprawl-based economy on the brink of collapse; they're looking around and saying, "What can we do differently?"
Fortunately, because of all of us in the cycling scene, they're asnwering their questions with, "I guess I can ride a bike to get around." This changes a lot of things.
For us, it means that our rides will take on a more humdrum establishment tone with police monitoring, etc. This is what legitimacy brings.
Wake up, the change you've all been working on is happening before your eyes.
Going out for a wild romp on your bikes with a crew of friends is not going to go away - but doing it with 1,500 people at rush hour on a Friday evening is a non-starter in this new era.
ubrayj0209.27.10 - 10:40 am
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Perfectly said.
I think we've got a ways to go yet and things won't just happen without continued effort, but there comes a point when you have to realize it's time to modify the tactics.
mr rollers responding to a
comment by ubrayj02
09.27.10 - 10:56 am
reply
I ride one ride because it's fun, fast, and adventurous. Not a "let's sit around with our tall boys and get high with my hipster buddies and 1 hipster girl we are all trying to fuck." But to each his own.
ScooterHayes
+1
Ninja biker responding to a
comment by ScooterHayes
09.27.10 - 11:07 am
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Once again, very well stated Ubrayj02....
dayone responding to a
comment by ubrayj02
09.27.10 - 11:17 am
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Very Well put both of you.
Its hard to understand the haters who bitch and whine about being treated fairly and with respect. How society doesn't approve of us and how motorist have disregarded our safety and rights ... then comes the time for us to rise and shine and prove to the world that we're not here to ruin their day, but to better. our rights as cyclists.
What better time than now. Both sides have caused controversy to their own extremes and now the whole city, county, state and country are watching us closely. Learning from us. Waiting for the next goof up...
We must show and prove ourselves not only to cyclist around the world but also to society; which is starting to listen to us and view us positively.
Lets move forward with the positive press. Positive relations with LAPD which aren't the best, but have improved recently with the help of countless Ridaz from all corners if Los Angeles.
So before others whine about what's going on...make sure they've asked themselves "What have I done to better the cycling community?"
Aktive_420 responding to a
comment by mr rollers
09.27.10 - 11:26 am
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The lack of leadership and lack of route that CM employs is more than "tradition" it is a structure that is frankly designed to prevent Critical Mass from being co-opted by corperations, political interests, and governments.
I am not sure that this is a concern here in LA. The City government and the LAPD are certainly not trying to shut down the ride..only asking that it be modified somewhat so that the City can support the ride. City sanctioned does not equate to City sponcered. You indicated that the leaderless structure is there to thwart attempts by government to shut it down...yet in LA its the leaderless structure that presents the greatest threat to critical mass and provokes the very response from government that it tries to prevent.
With regards to :
If LACM was to change to more closely resemble LAPDs vision of what the ride should be, I can promise that many of us would start a more traditional critical mass(es) to ride on instead.
I can certainly appreciate that...but keep in mind that depending on how many people show up we may be right back to where we are now. In short once the "new" Critical Mass reaches critical mass, depending on how the riders conduct themselves, its going to illiicit a response from the City.
I can honestly say that trickmilla is one of the most genuine, articulate and thoughtful individuals I have ever had the pleasure of meeting. I have a tremendous amount of respect for his opinions.
As trickmilla alluded to...cyclists need to give thought to what kind of Critical Mass they want to have. I am simply suggesting that many of the issues that were brought up (corking confussion, fractured ride, poor route) can be addressed and corrected with a little pre-planning. Or you can hold on to the current form of Critical Mass with some of its pitfalls. Sometimes you need to let something good go....so that you can find something better.
To all ridazz I say the choice is yours!
Sgt. David Krumer responding to a
comment by trickmilla
09.27.10 - 12:17 pm
reply
one of thoughts that came to mind while I was waiting at LACM for the ride to start was: what does an aerial view of all the riders trying to meet up look like?
I kind of thought about how though LACM is probably not going to be able to continue in it's principled fashion anymore (so it seems), that in some ways it did it's job so far. I keep wondering if it should still be called LACM (but whats a name really?).
unless I'm being completely fooled and everyone drove to LACM, then you have a convergence of hundreds of people getting there, and then riding off as this massive somewhat unnecessary group. How dope would it be if this group just said their "hello", and then just continued in pockets of 20 or so riders? People are hating the density of the ride and the slow pace, so then meet up and create your own mini LACM with some people. Be spontaneous and ride off with some people and try to engage the city more.
In my opinion, it's become more special to think about the convergence to LACM and the trickle of riders dispersing afterward that make LACM something to be proud of. We can focus so much on the content of the larger ride, but it's literally the bigger picture that matters more.
Seeing 5, 15, or single riders heading to their post LACM destination is really cool. Or at least to me.
If LACM died, then I'm sure LACM's deaths was not in vain.
md2 responding to a
comment by ubrayj02
09.27.10 - 12:31 pm
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Sgt. Krumer,
I've seen the LAPD helicopters dispatched fairly regularly during mass rides, do you know what, if any, video footage is taken by those helicopters?
If this footage is available, who would be the best person to talk to about obtaining copies?
(This isn't for any legal issue, just that I and a number of other riders think this would be something really cool to have available.)
Thanks!
JB
JB09.27.10 - 1:56 pm
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"THE WIND DOES NOT BREAK A TREE THAT BENDS! "(Sukuma African proverb)
Times are changing and we must learn to change with them. It doesn't make you a sell out for staying to the right of the double yellow,throwing your trash in the trash can, (or your own back pack), or accepting the help of LAPD to orchestrate the ride in a safe fashion. I understand that it's not cool for some to conform, but its no cooler for some to act like absolute teenie boppers and misfits. There is no culture loss to the organization of LACM...just less places to blaze that shit up....see even a stoner like myself can be accepting to some of these changes... No worries though... to those who want to avoid the eye of the law...i recommend starting private rides..not hosted on MR or even Facebook for that matter... If you wanna have a care free party ride, that's awesome...but it just can't happen with 100s or even 1000s... I believe there will be an interesting middle ground for all discrepancies.
FIXMYLIFE responding to a
comment by md2
09.27.10 - 1:58 pm
reply
Critical Mass is a simple formula that keeps working around the world.
And by "working" i mean, getting people to ride their bikes at a time and a place.
Sometimes Critical Masses have media interactions that draw the attention of a lot of people and power. That's when governments and agencies feel pressure to interact with and attempt control, change, or stop Critical Mass.
The viral structure of Critical Mass makes this very difficult if not impossible.
LACM has one agenda. To ride Bikes.
LAPD & The City of LA have many agendas: retain order, reduce conflict, and create the perception that LA is a city that enforces its laws safely and fairly.
To that end. It is understandable that interests aligned with LAPD & CoLA would want to see the changes you suggest be implemented.
It might be possible to order steak tartare and ask the chef grind it, grill it, and serve it on a bun.
It may make great burger, but nobody will be calling it steak tartare.
The changes you would like to see would make LACM a different ride.
Actually, it would be like most other rides ------>
but it wouldn't be "Critical Mass"
-------------
I do think there is a simple solution.
The city should sponsor its own monthly Civic Bike Mass.
Make it bigger, make it safer, make it funner.
Critical Mass rider-ship would dwindle down to the numbers it was at when the police or anybody else barely noticed that it existed.
Barring that kind of leadership, if LAPD feels that it needs to be at LACM, the most bang for our buck would be a focus on community style policing. Officers on Bikes and electric hybrids, talking to, and interacting with the people of critical mass.
The more that the populace trusts and respects the police on the mass, the less work it will take to serve and protect them.
trickmilla responding to a
comment by Sgt. David Krumer
09.27.10 - 2:01 pm
reply
Coming home at around 10:30 that night it was cool to still see groups of 10-15 CMers passing through downtown.
But, even with the well written posts by ubrayj02, rollers, sgt krumer, and Aktive_420 this whole thread makes me sad. It's the emasculation of LACM.
toweliesbong responding to a
comment by md2
09.27.10 - 2:04 pm
reply
We do film but I do not know the policies with regard to disclosure. I can do a little research and find out.
Sgt. David Krumer responding to a
comment by JB
09.27.10 - 2:11 pm
reply
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=62651&id=1011517267&l=5d250aacfd
feel free to tag yourself or anyone you know in my LACM photos. I post the same photos here at MIDNIGHT RIDAZZ.
barleye09.27.10 - 2:17 pm
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Dude hit me up I got 15 riders ready to go this LACM is a joke now the point is not to have route the point is to go to differstn places, The point is not matter what officer what his face is saying is bull because we can no longer go to Beverly hills or Rodeo drive. We need our own ride where we are not force to walk our bikes....
acegets22att.net
Acegets responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
10.12.10 - 3:09 am
reply
dude the LACM leaders are going to lable u a troll.
watch wat u say!
fixie4life responding to a
comment by Acegets
10.12.10 - 10:38 pm
reply
Does it matter???
LACM use to be fun it really sucks now! I know there are the few A-holes that attract the attention of the POPO but what i witnessed the last 2 LACM is a joke I.E. the AMPM incedent and all these POPO's handing out tickets like they were candy!! They might as well not escort and just sit at intersections handing out tickets!!! The leaders of LACM ? What Fucken leaders the Cops you mean! They can put a label on me if they want who gives a rats ass? We are here to ride and have fun if they are to join then welcome but don't get in the way, following the cops to a red light? what fun is that we do that with out them!! You can keep it!!! I have better things and better rides to attend to I used to love it but have lost intrest in walking my bike!!!
Acegets responding to a
comment by fixie4life
10.13.10 - 4:24 am
reply
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Ridazz Roulette!