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LA County Sheriff's doing contract-policing for West Hollywood.
Same authority that nailed limeyfly with the stereo-trailer rap.
About 5-6, squad cars showed up while everyone was regrouping near the sheriff's station.
It seems like Franz was nailed just as he was coming up the hill on the tallbike.
I'm under the assumption he could've been singled out, but someone else mentioned traffic tickets being blown out of proportion.
Whatever it is, hopefully it will iron itself out and we could all just look at this as a "how-to avoid" type of lesson for the future.
Damn those WeHo sheriffs . They need to be put under consent decree. A bicyclist is not a criminal. You don't need to waste taxpayer money putting a bicyclist in jail. Warn him, ticket him even, but jail?!
It's just ridiculous.
this is Suzy, Franz is not out, his bail was raised to $15,000. Dont know why. He isnt in a cell yet as of 11am this morning. Trying to post bail, but I need to find someone who has known him for over a year.... call me if you can help. 818 274 8010
-I was part of the advanced column that moved everyone else forward.
How many squad cars do they need for one cyclist?
We must have become a force to be reckoned with.
But, in all serious, let's just hope cooler heads prevail and that the Franz-dilemna get's worked through.
I've only known the man for 8 months, but not that well, yet.
12 cars. They wouldn't let anybody except drunk club goers within 90 feet of the scene. they were shining spot lights in everyone's face. Franz was basically tackled off his bike . . . but it wasn't as if he road past them and tried to get away - it looked like excessive force to me. The cops were not allowing any witnesses nearby.
WeHo is clearly out to fuck with Ridazz. When I talked to them, they were super belligerent about the rides. So was the watch commander.
One of them shoved Ms Stephanie when she went up to observe. They threatened to take everyone to jail who got close, even though it was only 10 riders or so who were coming down to observe. Way way excessive.
I for one will not buy anything in West Hollywood until Franz is freed. I may not shop there even after he is freed.
West Hollywood needs to realize, if they play rough...they better be ready for some real rough play. I will post on every bike forum that all bicyclists, environmentalists and green activists need to boycott the City of West Hollywood. All businesses, all services, all nightclubs, bars, liquor stores and coffee houses are effectively cut off until further notice.
We should organize a ride to the West Hollywood City Council meeting, and demand that they change their attitude towards bicyclists.
Finally, I don't think Los Angeles taxpayers should fund a subway through West Hollywood. If they intend to treat bicyclists, who will utilize the subway, like second-class citizens. Then they don't deserve the privilege and the business opportunity of a subway system that is designed to serve everyone, including the bicyclist.
No video to my knowledge. It was West Hollywood Sheriffs in West Hollywood. I'm calling the Watch Commander after 2pm. Anybody want his phone number. I think a mass of complaints to them from witnesses is a starting place.
Holy shit, Franz has been captured! This is sad times. F*$#ing police. Stupid ass BS tickets and now excessive force and sending an unarmed rider not harming anyone to jail without warning, this is fucking serious.
Franz had tickets that he never took care of before he escaped to Europe. Usually when you fail to appear in court, the system tends to frown upon this.
The extent of his unpaid tickets is overstated. Purportedly he only has one unpaid ticket, and it only recently went into collection. I've definitely been in that situation myself.
I have a call in to a friend who's husband is a criminal attorney, left a voice message. They are probably out-of-town, back east. it is the Jewish Passover holiday.
Just talked with Suzy.
He had a prior ticket that was ummm... forgotten and turned into a warrant. That alone explains the high bail.
He also didn't do well with the breathalyzer.
On top of that the cops slapped something like "resisting arrest" or "failing to obey a peace officer".
He'll be arraigned tomorrow. Since this is a misdemeanor he'll have a public defender to advise him. Tomorrow they'll probably set a trial date and lower his bail significantly to let him go cause the state of California doesn't have enough room in prisons for white college boys who ride bikes.
BTW, Stephen is the one who initially suggest calling the watch commander, and he already spoke with them. He gave me this info.
I've tried calling twice now to complain and each time he hasn't picked up. I'm going to try back after I do this little spandex ride.
Call this number - 310 855 8850 - and ask to speak to the watch commander to complain about last night, if you were a witness to anything that happened. Anytime is fine - there is always a watch commander on duty.
Talking points:
* Why tackle a cyclist off their bicycle?
* If you witnessed any aspect of the event ask to be added to the witness list
* Why were officers preventing people from witnessing
* 12 car response, excessive
* One deputy shoved a woman despite the fact that at least 12 other officers were present and no one else - excessive force
* Threatening to arrest witnesses - excessive
* Making it an issue about group of cyclists rather than an issue about one cyclist led to mishandling - cyclists are to be treated as individuals
Once you've called, if you feel comfortable post your notes here, and we can make sure to follow up in case the Sheriffs don't.
Alex C suggested rolling out to his arraignment Monday morning. Good idea? Bad idea?
I would like the watch commander's phone number. If you don't want to post in such a public forum (i.e, here), could you email it to me please? femmesdl@gmail.com.
Last night was an example of the cops finding something to justify their actions after the fact, and that cannot be acceptable to us. Not to mention a fairly large and intimidating sheriff pushing me back because I wanted to be able to see what they were doing to Franz (like Alex said, they had all of their flood lights on us, so we couldn't see what they were doing).
The whole thing was extremely frustrating, and I plan on calling and filing a complaint.
The first thing the sheriffs said was "Pull over or we're taking all of your bikes."
. . . . . . . .
I scoured the threads for the names of lawyers, and all I could find were personal injury attorneys. But maybe they could give a good recommendation. At least they'd know lawyers who know cycling law.
Gary Brustin: 800-841-2453. http://www.bicyclelawyer.com/
F. Anthony Koushan: 310-552-9596
David Olan: 310-312-3898
Christopher Morey: 714-432-9555
Thomas Forsyth, Esquire: 626-240-4633
I personally do not find jail a funny experience for anyone and I hope Franz is holden tight. But really, Franz in Jail? Picture it... If I were a fly on the wall in that cell...
Yeah katie, those are all personal injury bicycle attorney's. I talked to most of them when I was hit by an undercover Glendale cop.
I think we need a criminal attorney. One who can work on getting the case dismissed based on the misconduct of the Sheriff's department.
I wonder if the actions of the West Hollywood Sheriff's Dept last night needs to be investigated by a Federal authorities. It definitely seemed to be excessive and they seemed have an agenda.
As for the WeHo Sheriff's Department, Two issues: Franz and the Group.
1) Franz - Call Lt. Talmo (Detectives Bureau - gone for the day) but get to him and let him know that you were at the incident, that you want to be a witness to the incident. He is the one that will get the file and will include you in the investigation. 310-855-8850 (he will be back in tomorrow afternoon)
2) Group - Call now (310-855-8850) and file a complaint about *getting pulled over with a threat of losing your bikes *getting held for what reason? *getting spotlights in your eyes so that you can't witness the Franz incident * getting pushed, threatened etc. simply for wanting to witness the Franz incident.
At issue: Is it reasonable to pull over cyclists simply for their mode of travel? Is it reasonable for members of the community to offer themselves to a suspect as a witness? Is it appropriate for Law Enforcement to use spot lights to keep the public from witnessing their actions? Is it appropriate to push or threaten members of the public attempting to interact with law enforcement?
actually i have video of the whole thing on my memory stick. i will upload it once i get home. you can see when the cops turned their lights on those of us watching. you can see it's only 5 or 6 people watching when they do.
I just called the Sheriff's Department to file a complaint (to Stephen's point #2). I spoke to Sergeant Grunnell. His job is to file the complaint with the Sheriff's Department and send in on to a supervisor. It's a long, slow process -- two weeks, just to get confirmation that they received my complaint, then 60-90 days for it to be addressed by a supervisor. But the more complaints we get in, the greater this will be taken seriously. Make a paper trail, basically. Let's clear-cut the Amazon.
I was corrected by Steeve: The deputy's words were "Clear the left lane, or I'll take your bike."
I just spoke with Lt Tubbs, who just started a 12 hour shift. She was VERY professional - a complete counterpoint to the officers and watch commander I dealt with last night.
I filed a complaint - Watch Commanders Service Comment Report #209923
I think it would be good for some of us to complain to her to get this on her top items. On the other hand - if complaints were filed with multiple watch commanders by different people that would impress upon the Sheriff's that this was a big problem.
Please, if you were there and were upset with how things were handled call to file a complaint. It only took me 12 minutes.
its Suzy again...just spoke to Franz for about 45 mins. He wants everyone to know that he is OK. He was left in the dark about why he was in jail, and I had to fill him in on a)why he was arrested, b)what his bail was, c)when and where he will be arraigned. He was not mirandized. The jailer said that I need to call back the jail at 830 tomorrow morning to find out if he will be arraigned tomorrow or on tuesday. so, I will post here as soon as I find out more.
Whoever photo shopped those pics of Franz in jail is HYSTERICAL. I read him all of the posts and told him about the pics and made him laugh. He thanks everyone for their support. If he is not arraigned tomorrow visiting hours are from 11-1.
I also just called the watch commander (this is still suzy) and filed my complaint. She was very nice and said she had recieved a # of other complaints as well. sooooo start calling and complaining people!
I wasn't there, but if I was I would def call the watch commander, but don't forget that's not the only place that can get news of this. letters/phone calls to City Counsel(wo)men and congress(wo)men cound't hurt either. He wasn't merandized or told why he was being arrested? Tisk Tisk.
I was going to Trader Joes, but I realize it's in West Hollywood (Santa Monica & near La Brea). So I rode to the Silver Lake store instead. I will not patronize businesses in West Hollywood until Franz is freed!
This sucks that he has to spend another night in jail.
With 250 drunk guys pouring out of the Rage and Mickey's at 2:00AM getting into their cars and driving, you would think West Hollywood Sheriffs would have bigger fish to fry.
RBI - I don't think it has anything to do with stop signs = I don't think a foot down is necessary for a complete stop. However, this section does exactly what Richie said:
21201.
. . .
(c) No person shall operate upon a highway a bicycle that is of a size that prevents the operator from safely stopping the bicycle, supporting it in an upright position with at least one foot on the ground, and restarting it in a safe manner.
I was riding next to Franz coming up that hill by the cop station. He was having problems with his tallbike and I had the sound system trailer, so we were the last stragglers. I know why he was stopped, but I won't get into it on the internet. I observed how aggressive the cops got with him when he didn't comply fast enough for their liking. He was trying to get around one of their cars to dismount safely, but they wanted him down NOW.
My question is, would my calling them as a witness actually help his cause? Like if enough valid complaints get lodged, will they let him off?
I'm asking because I abhor talking to cops. I didn't even call the cops when my own apartment was burglarized. I find talking to them aggravating and futile, so before I get myself worked up on the phone with them, I'd like to know what end it will actually serve.
Come on man. You have to get involved. If they actually charge him with something you're going to get subpoenaed anyway. I know what you're talking about with your feelings about talking to cops in most situations - I have similar feelings, but your involvement is only going to help Franz. You're probably one of the only non LE witnesses to the actual grab.
Definitely you should speak to Lt Talmo, and I also think it would be beneficial for you to file a formal complaint.
After all this Franz is going to have to give all of us back rubs and hand jobs at the Franz is FREE party.
Dude. They need to figure out why they arrested him. Wow.
Suzy, did I hear properly that you contacted a lawyer? Stephen Box mentioned to me that Forsyth works on all kinds of bike law, not just personal injury cases.
Who deems that he wouldn't be able to do all those things? It's his bike so if he can "safely" come to a stop, climb down and hold the bike upright, then remount and ride, wouldn't that law really mean nothing? Would he have to show a video of his ability to do those things? Fucking open ended laws kill me.
This whole episode is such a joke it's killing me. A bench warrant and an open intox should not draw this much drama or such a high bail. I personally had a bench warrant issued for me that I never knew about. My payment for a "no registration" never arrived and they issued it. 4 years later, I got pulled over for a tail light out and the cop cuffed me. When I told him I had the cash on me to pay it, he let me follow him to the state police station and pay it on the spot. I guess that's why I don't understand why they're being such pricks.
I feel for you man and after last nights encounter, you anti-police notions were probably fortified.
So about approaching it differently.
What about complaining to the Los Angeles County District Attorney's office. The LA County DA is in charge of compliance and criminal prosecutions in West Hollywood. File a complaint about the actions of the West Hollywood Sheriffs department. What you saw, how they used excessive force. How they engaged in "reckless endangerment" of the bicyclist, etc, etc. Maybe everyone should do this.
The LA County District Attorney would then launch an investigation, to see whether there was misconduct and illegal actions taken by the Sheriffs department.
It's worth a try. Here is the number, but you have to wait until tomorrow to call, business hours. (213) 974-3512
katie, its Suzy from my own account now... I did contact 2 lawyers in Boston, both the parents of kids I used to nanny for. The father is head of Harvard's legal something or other and well connected. When I told them what happened they were really pissed about how all of this was because of drunken BICYCLE riding, not motorcycle riding like they originally thought. They have some lawyer friends here that obviously know CA law better than my boston people, and they put some calls in, but havent heard anything back yet because its the weekend and offices are closed. So, if this connection comes through at all (which it might not) it could potentially be best if Franz isnt arraigned until Tues so the lawyers have time to chat with him.... regardless, his mom and i will work on bail depending on what we hear tomorrow morning. argh!
Fine. I will call this Talmo tomorrow and volunteer to be a witness.
May the record show that I don't anticipate this will be anything but a tremendously frustrating time-waster. I'm not an activist, Alex. I just enjoy riding my bicycle in good company. And I never expect cops to be anything but the fascists they are...it simply goes with the job. No amount of foot-stomping will ever change whatever chromosomes they are missing.
You owe me one, Franz. Seriously, you have no idea how much I hate cops. I just got a bike-related ticket in Redondo Beach on Wed, so my ire for them is particularly high at the moment. But I'll do it.
Footstomping!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Best term ever.
Dude, I'm not enjoying this one at all either. That big supervisor wanted to wreck me, and he was spoiling for a fight. I wonder how many of these guys are ex military dealing with battle stress. Supposedly (SB says) the LA Sheriff's spend their first two years working at LA County Jail, so maybe that's the issue = they're just paranoid as balls.
If they didn't mirandize him, give him access to an attorney, or tell him what he was being arrested for isn't the whole thing kind of moot? They wouldn't be able to make chewing gum stick to that, let alone a criminal charge. I can't see that he's going to have much trouble getting off if that proves to be the truth of the matter, particularly if there are witnesses to the lack of miranda rights and it sounds like there were.
i saw the pictures before i saw this thread and basically that many cops made it seem like osama bin laden was trying to start some kind of midnight gay parade, not take one man of a bicycle.
A little housecleaning, if I may. This applies to various things that people have said in the thread.
1) There's nothing in the CVC that says that a bicycle rider has to put a foot down at a stop sign. Therefore, trackstanding at a stop sign is not running the stop sign, "technically" or otherwise. As long as you come to a complete stop behind the limit line before you proceed, you're 100% legit.
2) No such thing as West Hollywood P.D. It's the Los Angeles Sheriff's Office, West Hollywood Station.
3) The police don't have to Mirandize you when they arrest you. They only have to read you your Miranda rights if you are in custody AND they want to question you. If you can establish that they didn't Mirandize you, any answers you gave to questions they asked you while you were in custody are inadmissible in court. Remember, though, that it's entirely possible to secure a conviction in criminal court without introducing into evidence any of the defendant's responses to questioning. (Disclaimer: IANAL)
Whatevs, the press aren't going to give two hoots, nor are WeHo City Council whether Sheriff's *must* mirandize him. What they're going to see is that the Sheriff's didn't, and that will appear to a be deliberate attempt to disenfranchise him. It will appear that the Sheriff's dept does not care to treat people fairly, and in the court of public opinion that = EPIC FAIL.
What they're going to see is that the Sheriff's didn't, and that will appear to a be deliberate attempt to disenfranchise him.
No, it won't, because it isn't.
The idea that the police have to Mirandize people when they arrest them is a straight up urban legend. It's that simple. It'll only take one person--press, City Council, or otherwise--to point this out, and you'll look like jackasses. Never, EVER go out there and say things that make it look like you don't know what you're talking about, no matter how tempting. The risk of somebody calling you on it is too great.
If you're going to make a big public fuss over what the LASO did wrong, do it over stuff that they actually did wrong. It looks like there's plenty of that to work with.
Mirandizing people is good LE practice, regardless of whether it's required. That's the whole fucking reason it is required under certain circumstances - the Supreme Court thought not doing this was such bad practice under certain circumstances as to be detrimental to the rights of citizens, and therefore chose to require it.
I seriously doubt the WeHo attitude is "we only desire the minimum required by law from our LE." WeHo should ask more of it's local LE. That's exactly the point, and that's exactly how I would make it before this discussion, and it's how I would make it after. Is this what WeHo wants? A LE agency which does the minimum required, purportedly holds people without disclosing charges, doesn't mirandize or inform people of their rights?
Seriously PC, do you really believe that's how the public will react. "They did the minimum possible, and that satisfies me."???? I doubt it.
I don't even understand why I'm writing this = it was all implicit in my last post, and you're smart enough to read between the lines.
Take a deep breath and listen to what I'm saying. I'm giving you facts. Absorb them, and then you can use them.
Please read up on the Miranda case. Miranda rights ONLY concern questioning while in custody. There is no point in Mirandizing a person who isn't going to be questioned while in custody.
As to other (non-Miranda) rights, like the right to remain silent when not in custody, in an ideal world maybe the police would advise people of such things even though they don't have to. In this world, they rarely do so. You know what else is rare? Cases of the public getting outraged because law enforcement didn't go above and beyond the routine in advising suspects of their rights, but instead merely operated by the book. Just saying. Don't shoot the messenger.
On the other hand, if ol' Franz asked why he was being arrested and they didn't tell him, that's a legitimate beef. There are actually a lot of legitimate beefs in this case, including some outrageous ones like tackling riders, pushing and shoving witnesses, and devoting 12 patrol cars to a nonviolent group of cyclists in the first place. That's where you're going to generate your public outrage.
Attack with your strong suit, is what I'm trying to say.
There's nothing wrong with rolling 12 cars to the scene of an arrest. It definitely seems excessive to us, but bear in mind that cops are obligated to assume that everyone they interact with during a bust is a potential violent confrontation waiting to happen. I don't know how many folks were in the mob this weekend, but I don't have any trouble believing that the officers took one look at a crowd of 100+ less-than-sober cyclists and called for significant backup. Most cops I know would have done the same thing. Having all 12 cars sit around long after any threat has abated, on the other hand, is a waste of city resources but it is certainly not illegal.
hi guys... just spoke with the C-U-Next Tuesday of a jailer and she said that he wasnt being arraigned til tomorrow. So, I'm going to visit him today and see how he's doing and talk about bail with him. The delay could be positive as far as getting a good attorney....
hi< its suzy. going to meet with a lawyer right now, then to visit Franz and talk bail with him. Before anyone goes to visit him at the jail can you call the jail first and see how many visitors he's allowed per day? I have a feeling it may only be one and I need to talk to him about stuff.... so call me if you have any questions or want me to give him a message. 818 274 8010
I fell asleep because I held my breath too long reading PC's post. Dammit - that was 6 weeks of no sleep, ruined by PC.
PC - leaning on Wikipedia now - this is what I recalled - that mirandizing also involves informing the arrestee of their right to an attorney, not just in questioning, but in general:
"the person must be clearly informed that he or she has the right to consult with an attorney and to have that attorney present during questioning, and that, if he or she is indigent, an attorney will be provided at no cost to represent him or her."
I do agree that those other issues are of equal or greater value.
i'd just like to point out that even if one of the officers yelled about clearing the left lane, by the time Franz and i (along with JC and a couple other riders) caught up with the mob, everyone was already dismounted and on the sidewalk.
If you haven't already done so, please please please call in and file a complaint with the watch commander. Getting a big volume of complaints in is super important. Let 'em know that when they do stupid shit like this, we won't just sit back and take it. There are consequences to being colossal douches.
Sergeant Grunnell, the guy I talked to, was downright reasonable, pleasant even, and there were similar reports from the people who talked to Lieutenant Tubbs.
How amazing would it be if 200 people called in and complained? They prevented 200 people from witnessing (bright lights shining right into the faces of people trying to witness -- if they stand by their actions, then why don't they want us to see?), and they threatened to take the personal property of 200 people in place of a warning (wildly inappropriate -- just ask us to clear the lane, and we'll do it, but do NOT touch my bike). Fucked up! Call it in!
Franz via Suzy, asks that I post the latest update.
Franz is being arraigned on Tuesday. This is after we were told he would likely be released Sunday morning. Then we were told he would be arraigned today. Bail was set at $15K, but has been lowered to $10K.
He's still wearing the clothes he was wearing Sunday night - short shorts and the jacket in this photo. He's freezing but they won't give him something to stay warm. Apparently he is alone in a cell and they won't even give him pen and paper. Jail would whoop my ass with boredom.
Suzy went to visit during visiting hours, but the Sheriff's canceled visiting hours due to major demolition work in the lobby. Suzy and Franz's aunt showed up and were informed then that they could not visit, not earlier in the day when they called to confirm visiting hours.
I pity anyone who is in jail or prison. This is a shameful way to treat people.
The above is now just part of a litany of wrongs in this specific case. WeHo bills itself as a progressive place, but they employ thugs to police their city. If you were present please call to complain - 310 855 8850 - ask for the Watch Commander. If you witnessed any part of Franz getting pulled down and arrested call the same number, ask for Lt Talmo, and say that you want to be included and interviewed as a witness.
Can we start a list of people who have called to complain, and a list of witnesses to Franz's arrest? If you've already called to complain I think it's time to start calling Council people, or perhaps the LA County DA's office. Thoughts?
I'm going to keep it straight it and simple, but to the point.
I mean, the way they had everyone park themselves on the curb was a safety hazard in its own right.
With all the foot-traffic going on right there, I was worried about a fight starting with the non-ridazz.
Another thing to consider would be the psychological-trauma some might've felt.
They see a cop-car, hear it's loudspeaker with the order being given the way it was.
They may have just put quite a few people under "duress".
Falsely planting the idea into the head that they actually did something wrong.
What about witnesses? I haven't called for that yet. I didn't witness much except for a lot of yelling by the sheriffs, once hearing the phrase "You don't get to tell us how to do our jobs." But I'll call.
Didn't the Culver City cops say that once? They're both wrong. We can say whatever we want. Whether or not there are consequences to what we say is a different matter.
While we're all complaining to the sherif's department in weho, has anyone remembered to call the cool cop's chief and compliment them on their service? In the interest of preventing these negative situations in the future, it may be just as important that we remember to appreciate the police who support us so that they will continue to down the line. In times when tall bikes get tackled to the ground and it takes a dozen police cars to arrest just one cyclist, we need all the support we can get from friendly law enforcement. Does anybody remember what district we were in when the nice officer stopped traffic to let us all through to the 7eleven? My geographical memory is a little... retarded.
Ashira and I have his email . . . but - he may not want that kind of support. LAPD leaves us alone for the most part, but that does not mean they condone what we're doing. We have to be careful not to out anybody. I do agree though that we should publicly praise those departments which act reasonably. So far that's Beverly Hills PD, which basically just asks us to move along, and LAPD.
I feel terrible for Franz! I am at work around the corner from the Pacific Design Center and all i want to do is walk a blanket and some good food from Urth over to him.
Culver City does not like us. Two tickets and 9 cop cars at CRANK Mob October from Culver City PD, and then they pulled over the box and ticketed Richie and searched all kinds of shit in March.
Well I don't want to blow anybody's cover but I wish there was a way to return the favor. Would an anonymous compliment drive hurt an officer's reputation? I guess I could see how that might be possible. Either way, if you've got his contact info, say thanks for me the next time you talk to him!
oh, btw, I filed a complaint on behalf of franz. I was right in front of him when we made our way up that little hill after stopping to see if he needed help fixing his rear derailer a few blocks earlier. They didn't give him the room he needed to dismount and that was fucked.
That's Rusty the Crank Mob Cop! He's from the West LA division and he rules. Probably the nicest cop in the city. Their number is 310.444.0701. Since today is my day for calling police stations, I'm going to call and offer some praise where it's due. He genuinely is a good guy.
Rusty Redican is his full name, I think. Too bad there aren't more like him.
soooooooooo I wasn't there... does it still make sense for me to call and complain?? they are holding my friend in jail... and I don't like it. that's complaint enough for me, but what should I say to the cops if I wasn't there when he was arrested?
booo!!! seriously now... i hate when theyz CREATE disruptions by supposedly preventing it. they know full well they can get away with certain things so the wheel keeps turning. they like sheep who eat three times a day and sit at home and watch tv.
Someone should film the event. Franz coming out of the Sheriffs station. A crowd of well-wishers cheering. An impromptu interview. All up on Youtube by 9 pm tonight.
Didn't know whether or not to post this in this thread, or the CMob thread.
Since it's basically just Franz maintaining his status as jousting-champ, then what the Hell.
Since Franz is going through some harsh times, I feel we should also focus on the lighter side of things to prevent ourselves from going "stir-crazy" in the absence of the man himself.
So, here it is:
Just rad the whoile thread!!! THis absolutely sucks.
Franz, hope everything goes well. Anyone there should get on the phone, like any cause, support is needed!! Anyway to get a paer involved by way of a story?? LAWeekly??
CAN I BE A WITNESS!!!??? Same bunch that gave me the noise ticket, they are out and about and they think it's hunting season.
Oh yeah and it's true they start out in the County jail. I guess after being locked up themselves they need to vent.
what is he getting let out at midnight? I have work the next day -- if it fits, I will be there! Plus, I am working right around the corner from there now.
I called Suzy during my lunch break to wish Franz well, and latest word I've heard from Meghan who called Suzy a little while after I did, is that bond has been posted. Suzy was waiting for Franz outside the jail.
Assuming the situation did not suddenly change, Franz is free!!!!! Keeping fingers crossed.
If we do not ride for Franz tonight -- we must ride for him another night. For as we were safely celebrating the beautiful day yesterday (dazed and confused) Hanz missed it all !!!
For FREEDOM...
They may takle our souls, but they can never take our Bicycles!
Jesus christ. $15,000 dollars for Franz??? And btw, that's temporary.
Hmmm
W.W.F.D.???
What Would Franz Do?
Q: Franz is riding a tall bike with fluorescent orange shorts meant for a 7 year old girl. You have a beer in one hand, another tucked into your shirt. You see cops up ahead. Does he...
A) Drink the beer in his hand quickly and ride by like he isn't drunk nor C.R.A.N.K. Mobbing it.
B) Think to himself, "I'm a photographer and my left nut is about to plop out. Maybe i should stop, ditch the beer and walk by them"
C) Realize how beautiful the blue and reddish cop lights are and ponder about if he was actually still taking pictures, it would be a perfect moment.
D) Fart.
or E) See that the MOB is just ahead and not even notice the swarm of cops to his right about to tackle him.
Major bummer about Franz. But I think it's worth having a bigger discussion about when we do and do not take both lanes.
When the first cop car rolled up to the front of the ride, he yelled "clear the left lane", and people were slow to do so. Some ignored him or gave him attitude. You've gotta wonder if the group had been out of the lane in the first place, or much quicker to clear it, if things would have gone down like they did.
We should all know by now, the way to keep cops on your good side is to swallow your pride and follow orders. But the more incidents like Saturday night, the more the cops in all areas are going to start cracking down as soon as they see/hear about a ride. Look what happened to Santa Monica Crit-mass. We can't let that spiral into other rides, all over the city.
I, for one, would be OK with it if we had a hard and fast rule to always keep the left lane open on two lanes streets if it means our rides have a better chance at continuing to coexist with the city and the cops. I'm all for keeping the rides free-from, but maybe there's some basic ground-rules and etiquette we should self-enforce to make sure we can keep riding.
I'll post this separately if anyone thinks this is worth separate and specific Ridazz feedback -- which i think it does.
1) WeHo Sheriff's went after LACM last month, so there is a good chance this incident was the product of a policy shift.
2) CVC 21202, says ride as far to the right as practicable. It does not confine cyclists to the right most lane. Individual riders on Critical Mass, Midnight Ridazz, or any other ride have the right to use the 2nd lane, the left lane, if there is not room to ride in the rightmost lane. Bizarre, but true. We can also ride three lanes abreast if it's not practical to ride in the rightmost or 2nd rightmost lane. !!!!!! We really are traffic.
if this is true and it makes sense, what is illegal and what can be done to keep this from happening in the future? Would yelling out codes as they are tackling us be fair -- or were we just in the wrong place at the wrong time Saturday Night?
Alex, i hear ya. You're totally right. That's indeed the law.
But I just wonder if there are times where compromising and not asserting that right might buy us more friends in the law enforcement community. They don't care for little specifics of bike law. They just don't want the streets to look like an unsanctioned rowdy parade. I'm not saying always keep the left lane clear but maybe when cops are spotted or, for example, shouting at us to "clear the left lane."
I'm not even sure if the idea I floated is the right one, but I think it's worth brief consideration.
I agree with keeping one lane open for traffic. Just because we can take all lanes doesn't mean we should. We have to compromise since we do not have the numbers that non cyclists have.
Things have changed, I think Law Enforcement was more tolerant when our rides were once a month. Now that we have several rides each weekend, the traffic we create might be viewed as a bigger problem and is being dealt with accordingly.
Also, I want to point out a basic difference between CM and MR rides. CM rides have an agenda and taking up all lanes is part of its MO. MR rides are social rides through the city and leaving a car lane open was always recommended.
As always people mis-characterize CM and MR. CM has no specific agenda. It's a potluck.
@0gravity
I recognize that you're saying this might be a good PR move. Perhaps. I just want to make sure everyone understands - if we've got the volume of riders to do it, then we're not breaking the law by taking 2, 3, 4 or 5 lanes of traffic.
Or 6.
Riders should be more savvy about how they handle police . . . and if you look at SMCM riders these days they're much smarter than they used to be. Still, the police have an obligation to adhere to the law, and they weren't doing it.
i believe in order to avoid any problems with the police and to stay on their good side, we avoid riding our bikes all together.
the sheriff deputies are, after all, trained professionals who serve the public good. and if they see fit to tackle a bicyclist, they must have good reason. franz obviously did something seriously criminally wrong. like not have lights. or pants.
alex suggests that the law says riders have the right to use a left lane for passing or turns. the police don't agree. personally i'm more inclined to believe a uniformed professional over alex, who is merely a bicyclist.
so perhaps we add a second thank you, mr. police man, to the MR website... for teaching us proper respect for authority and removing from the streets a rolling traffic obstacle that many affectionately call franz.
Both MR rides and CM rides take up all the lanes. I have rarely seen any other type of behavior on the rides.
The CM agenda is the same as the MR agenda, to have fun, to exert their right to ride on the streets and to show the car culture that they must accept the presence of bicycles on the streets.
San Francisco and the New York City CM may be more aggressive, militant and politically charged, but the Los Angeles and Santa Monica CM's have created a different bicycle riding climate, one of educating drivers and the public through dialogue, graciousness and mutual respect.
I agree with Alex, bicycle traffic is "traffic" and to require a large group of bicyclists to stay in right lanes is like telling African-Americans to sit in the back of the bus or Gay people to get back in the closet. Those days are over. We demand equality and we will get it. Regardless of the difficult struggle ahead.
Not just turns and passing. The CVC does not say you must be in the right lane except in those circumstances. It says you must right to the ride as is practicable. If the lane is full of bikes, that means you get to ride in the 2nd lane.
The CVC ALSO says that you may change in to other lanes to pass or turn, but it does not specify that this is the only circumstance under which you can do this.
personally, i'll ride in whichever lane, at whatever speed, and break whichever rules that keeps me safe. on a road bike in traffic, the last thing i'm worried about is a ticket. but most importantly, i make sure there's no bench warrants on my ass.
Oh, and a bit of a side note, my only real observation for the event (i was at the very front of the ride ad was pretty clueless about what was going on before we walked to the other side of the street, so I didnt really see anything other than a long line of cop cars with lights in my eyes.
Anyway, we were stopped at the light on santa monica when the cops got to the front of the ride, screaming at us over the megaphone that we had to get off our bikes or they were going to take them away. Stopped at a light, yeah we sure were impeding traffic more than that red light or the cars whizzing past in the other direction were. This whole thing sounds like targeted harassment, unfortunately Franz got targeted.
Hey, can Franz file a complaint to the watchman? He has a lot to complain about. The paperwork for his complaints could obliterate a whole ream of paper.
(a) I have to say most def not. Just like you richie, Franz has no regard for authority.
(b) no, not that either. I don't think Franz think of himself in terms of a job title. So what if his nut pops out, Franz doesn't care about nudity and it would, in his mind, most likely enhance the outfit that he is wearing
(c) NO, Franz is most likely looking at some cutie on the ride, to be worrying about flashing lights and wanting to take a picture of them.
(d) tough call, this seem probable, but unlike, since Franz doesn't eat often to have a fart brewing
(e) YES...not just by process of elimination. Franz always keeps his eye on the prize.
Ah you guys know WWFD is my favorite game. So I was released earlier today thanks to the lovely Suzie. My bail bondsman tells me I am now hers to do with as she pleases. I will have much to say and plan on writing a little something up on my experiences. Let's just say I hadn't heard good things about the LASD and they went above and beyond their reputation. They were at times incompetent but always oppressive.
Thank You for all of your support! I will probably need some more in the near future. For right now I'm just happy to be able to be out.
I'm headed to MAO's Venice right now for a celebratory actual meal and drink. Feel free to call or stop by.
Q: Franz is riding a tall bike with fluorescent orange shorts meant for a 7 year old girl. You have a beer in one hand, another tucked into your shirt. You see cops up ahead. Does he...
A) Drink the beer in his hand quickly and ride by like he isn't drunk nor C.R.A.N.K. Mobbing it.
B) Think to himself, "I'm a photographer and my left nut is about to plop out. Maybe i should stop, ditch the beer and walk by them"
C) Realize how beautiful the blue and reddish cop lights are and ponder about if he was actually still taking pictures, it would be a perfect moment.
D) Fart.
or E) See that the MOB is just ahead and not even notice the swarm of cops to his right about to tackle him.
Oh wait I was release earlier on today, AGHH A weekend in the county. Thank GOD i 'm out !! And my beloved Girl friend has forgiven me for being a complete douche bag. Lets not let this happen again and I think we'll be just fine.
clear the lane. remember we are part of the department of vehicles as opposed to dept. of motorized vehicles. also the police need to set up blocks as they do for motorized vehicles because i for one would like to you tube one tackling one of those. 2 wrongs don't make a right. tie goes to law and order and the outcome will soon prevail. clear the lane
Don't shop or spend money in West Hollywood for through Memorial Day Weekend. Plan a protest ride to the Weho Sheriff's department. Ride around and chant how unfair and unlawful Weho Sheriff's treated bicyclists.
Delmese was likely the Watch Commander that night, and seemed to have specific knowledge about when Franz was in the holding cell. I don't think he was on the street, but he definitely wasn't impartial.
@Fuzzbeast
If the group has the energy to go beyond this, I'll definitely write something more editorial-ish.
It's funny how Downtown LA has changed from when I was a teenager. Being a brown teenager in the Echo Park/Rampart are in the 70's, life was a pain when dealing with cops. Being harassed was a weekly, sometimes daily ritual. The chances of going to jail or prison was very good and something that was expected.
Fast forward to the present, Downtown LA is a very different landscape. The reverse exodus and gentrification of Downtown LA changed its demographics. I remember the only white people I dealt with were cops, teachers and a manager at work. Yeah, there were some white kids too but they were from the hippie enclaves of Silverlake and Elysian Heights.
I not try to detract from the efforts of Alex et al about raising awareness to the unfairness and injustice that Franz suffered. This certainly a matter that shouldn't be taken lightly.
But there is a lighter side to this. From a brown man's perspective, all the effort and the protests that occurs when white folk suffer injustice is, in a sick kinda way, funny.
I think there are three or four names of bikey lawyers higher up the thread. Stephen Box recommended one of them above the others. I would go back up and copy-paste, but I'm tired, and you have eyeballz.
Crankmob is saturday that is the safest bet, but I'm having a few celebration vodkas on the beach today. So you never know!
As for the tickets I still owe both the SMPD and LAPD quite a bit as I wasn't quite on top of them as I was with CRANkmob charges. Both the Obstruction and the Cycling DUI were thrown out. However my tall bike is gone forever, cut off a pole this week I had locked it to at the sheriff's station (because they broke it).
Wow, that is great...though i have to say i think you must have been pretty lucky...the DUI is silly, but you WERE riding a bike with open containers, i'm pleasantly surprised they (correctly, i think) decided it wasn't worth it to press the issue.
Hooray for Franz! Now bring me/let me come check out that freitag bag already!
It was at one time, you work off your fine debt, with $25 a day off your debt, for a day in jail.
Being for every day in jail they deduct $25 off your debt
Now don't get to excited and think it will take forever in jail to pay your fines off.
Remember that $25 is the original fine, not the fine with the penalty assessments which can be 270% to 350% of the original fine.
So if you owe say a $117 for one ticket, that would most likely count as a day in jail. You should see if you can use the days in jail, in which they had no case against you, towards the fines for your other tickets.
So it not the total that you that you would serve time for, it is the original fine minus the penalty assessment fees. Penalty assessments don't count if you are serving time in lieu of paying the fine.
It might be more then $25 a day now, but I doubt it, they never raise the fines, just the penalty assessment percentage
Take care of it before they pick you up. It will be easier for them to release you, on signature, if you are charge with a misdemeanor or infraction, if you don't have a warrant. If they run your name and where planning to let you go on a warning, now they will most likely bring you in, to take you to court the following business day.
this part is personal, you might want to remind whoever loving flipped the bill to get you bailed out of jail that it is cheaper to pay your fines now, then pay a bail bonds and deal with all the worry having a loved one locked away. Left to the horrors and depravity of who knows what could happen to you, if your left locked up in that God forsaken pit of hell.
Thank Goodness you have people who love and care for you. You are a Rich and Lucky Man.
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Ridazz Roulette!
I personally do not find jail a funny experience for anyone and I hope Franz is holden tight. But really, Franz in Jail? Picture it... If I were a fly on the wall in that cell...
In his block...
Franz ... you are a crimanimal.
when is the break Franz out of jail ride?
oh noes!
booo!!! seriously now... i hate when theyz CREATE disruptions by supposedly preventing it. they know full well they can get away with certain things so the wheel keeps turning. they like sheep who eat three times a day and sit at home and watch tv.
FRANZ!!!!!!!!!
Proof that the 
YES!!!!
FUZZBEAST, GOTO SLEEP!
Good luck Franz
FREE AT LAST!
Waterboarding isn't as bad as they make it seem.