blood doping
Thread started by
Jet-son at 05.25.10 - 8:16 pm
he said! she said! he dopes she dopes we dope..."ok i cheated! but so does everyone else"
even if Lance does dope (which i beleive in my heart to be untrue) if everyone cheats but lance wins 7 times...hes still top dog....landis can suck armstrongs sweaty testicle..
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.....i never really saw it that way before
Jet-son responding to a
comment by mattspeed
05.25.10 - 9:28 pm
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Lance will never be caught for blood doping because he has been successful with
gene doping. Gene doping is a new proven technology that minipulates DNA through
a virus. In the future steroids and doping will be outdated and surpassed by this.
a side note: 4 out of 10 mice who received gene doping fell victim to nut cancer.
Dedicated81805.25.10 - 11:14 pm
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even if Lance does dope (which i beleive in my heart to be untrue) .
Jet-son
05.25.10 - 11:16 pm
Wow! Really?
Man I have a great deal on some ocean front property in Nevada I’d like to let you in on. Let me know when you have some time.
John05.26.10 - 9:04 am
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What I found really interesting about the documentary above is that they talked to a cyclist that uses a compression chamber to sleep in and his assertion that that was biochemically the same as training in a mile-high city or taking some performance enhancers.
Basically the implication was that there are 3 routes to the same exact physical effect, but only 2 are legal. and the one that is illegal is the one thats less expensive and more accessible.
trickmilla05.26.10 - 10:06 am
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beach front property in Nevada?...wait...oh i see what you did there....i get it..im not stupid ....theres no beach front houses in Nevada.....available this time of year...
and I dont give a shit if Lance smokes angle dust before every race...Im just tired of seeing all these great athletes legacies ruined. Professional athletes devote their lives to their sport...if their passion and commitment to it is so great that they must chemically or physically alter their body to allow themselves to progress and reach a level of performance that is far past the average athletes capacity to comprehend..they are explorers of the human body..pushing themselves, progressing with the sport....
At least every baseball player should be on roids using corked bats....to make that game at least a little interesting...
Jet-son responding to a
comment by John
05.26.10 - 10:51 am
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They kill there own legacies.... you are right they do devote there lives to play the game ... but that's what it takes to become a professional.. hard work and dedication to be above average .... your crazy if you think its okay for athletes to using performance drugs ... I remember watching Shawn Merriman break Priest Holmes back in the middle of a game because he was so juiced up...
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Jet-son
05.26.10 - 11:07 am
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I think Lance doped. I can't imagine he was that much better than his peers who have been caught.I never cared that he doped because had he not doped up, it would not have looked as amazing watching him accelerate as he did. And isn't that the weird part about sports in general -- the viewing of them -- which is either exciting, amazing or forgettable. Lance made some shit look amazing and he got rich and famous from it so he didn't have to die trying.
He should have focused on more of classic races though, not just winning the tour. I think Miguel Indurain probably could have won 7 tours and he was probably clean.
md2 responding to a
comment by Jet-son
05.26.10 - 11:15 am
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HA .. he ended his career.. then he got caught and he hasn't produced anything since and that's why the Chargers want to trade him....
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Jet-son
05.26.10 - 11:23 am
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nobody ever says "No way was Jimi Hendrix the best guitarist ... everybody knew he was doping to improve his creative performance"
trickmilla05.26.10 - 11:23 am
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Angle dust is the best. To die for, Faustino, to die for.
Fausto Coppi responding to a
comment by Jet-son
05.26.10 - 11:24 am
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because its sounds ridiculous that's why ...
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 11:28 am
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That is an interesting point.
I personally think Lance did what he did because he had a very good plan, he had good coaches and Doctors and he always built a good team for TDF. And he was mostly lucky...Like in 2003 when Beloki went down hard in front of lance and Lance scooted off the course like he was mt biking.
He is probably the most tested athlete in the modern sports era....is it possible he doped? Yes but I think he is just Lucky, smart and a little special.
Foldie responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 11:30 am
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i think people say that, but I think they're just as high as Hendrix. But I can see where your analogy is headed, it is like saying, give cyclist a break since we approve of people with pectoral and breast implants.
Some people will just do whatever it takes to win.
md2 responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 11:32 am
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perhaps ... but regardless, athletes are held to different standard than most other people.
some even get banned from the sport for using performance REDUCING drugs.
None of it really makes any sense.
trickmilla05.26.10 - 11:33 am
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Because they are suppose to be the best of the best ...
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 11:42 am
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im surprised you think that...
For one, you have drug use, period. So you have those that would criticize Hendrix just as much as Lance.
Then you have drug use that benefits your ability to compete at a higher level (i.e. higher than you would be able without the drug(s)).
In your analogy, it is very unclear whether drugs make Hendrix a better guitarist. Maybe it made him worse. But then maybe crystal meth allows one guitarist to stay up practicing more than another guitarist.
Now, I think one thing would be fairly easy to assume. Let's say American Idol has a guitar playing version, lets call it the "Air Guitar Championships" (though nothing that stupid would occur of course). Now participants may need to practice their skills during Idol boot camp, and I think they would be banned if it were found they were taking crystal meth to stay up practicing, whereas others were sober.
The point being -- what is it about being in the context of competition (not just sports), that makes performance enhancing drugs frowned upon (by some)?
md2 responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 12:14 pm
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but in large part it is cheating because it's banned. the real issue is why are x,y,z, banned? Because its cheating!! <--- hey thats not fair, that's cheating; stick to logic. A bit of begging the question... okay, okay...
But why are some substances banned? Because they are harmful? Unfair advantage? Promote drug use to kids who look up to them?
md2 responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
05.26.10 - 12:30 pm
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Hendrix was an artist not an athlete
Jet-son05.26.10 - 12:47 pm
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Of course they are harmful ... you are introducing something more into your body to your body that it already produces and eventually you introduce so much of it it your body will produce more of something else to accommodate the rise.
Of course its an unfair advantage... your taking an easy simple way to gain something that someone else is working twice as hard to get .... sure you have to still work but with less effort ..
Of Course it promotes drug use among kids ..... Myself, a couple of my teammates and numerous players in my H.S Football league made the choice to do banned substances . I myself stopped because I figured I would feel more accomplished if I ran the extra bleachers, lifted more weights and put the time and effort in to be the best. When you hear about all these amazing players doing it and getting a slap on the wrist ... you kinda feel like ... well since they are.. I have to .. when thats not the case.
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by md2
05.26.10 - 1:15 pm
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Gene Doping does exsist but your narrow minds can only perceive drug use.
Dedicated81805.26.10 - 2:38 pm
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Im sure it does .... and out of all people you have the nerve to call someone narrow minded ...
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Dedicated818
05.26.10 - 2:49 pm
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Your a prime example of someone who is narrow minded. If someones opinions
differ from what you perceive as PC they are catagorized into the group you have
decided to hate.
Dedicated818 responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
05.26.10 - 3:23 pm
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Gene Doping does exsist but your narrow minds can only perceive drug use.
i dont think genetic manipulation really works like that on the level of multicellular complex organisms.
more the reason to call for genetic passports.
_iJunes responding to a
comment by Dedicated818
05.26.10 - 3:42 pm
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"Bigger Stronger Faster" is a really good movie. I'm not an expert on steroid (as most of you guys seem to be) but I feel that even though the narrator of the film was leaning towards using them, I feel it gave a pretty good pro vs. con points.
Personally I view steroids like weed. Legalize it.
@Foldie..."Like in 2003 when Beloki went down hard in front of lance and Lance scooted off the course like he was mt biking".... LOL! ps. thanks for linking the vid. that saved me some time :)
Gizzard responding to a
comment by trickmilla
05.26.10 - 3:44 pm
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"Personally I view steroids like weed. Legalize it."
hmmm that came out wrong. i meant to say "Personally my point of view on steroids is the same as it is towards weed. Legalize it." But that doesnt sound much better...
Gizzard05.26.10 - 3:46 pm
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Me close minded ... that's cute ....
@ Gizzard .. I 100% disagree... they are illegal because you can seriously flip out and kill someone with such high levels of testosterone strolling through your body ...
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Dedicated818
05.26.10 - 4:01 pm
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the future of sports..... gene manipulation...athletes will be allowed to reconstruct their body down to the bones..their bodies will be a blank canvas subject to and limited by our future scientific capabilities.. the athletes construction of self will become part of the sport itself.. opening up all sorts of opportunities for more extreme and entertaining sports..athletes will be completely devoted to reaching their peek performance and will be unconcerned with any physical mutations effecting their personal life...they will become taller and uglier and faster....like an avatar.....hahahaha... ???.
this comment waas brought to you courtesy of lemon diesel...
Jet-son05.26.10 - 4:03 pm
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i dunno. as i said, im not an expert, but it seems to me that if you legalize it you can regulate it that of course doesnt mean people wont abuse it... but there's plenty of things that people abuse, and flip out and kill people with (ie: alcohol) that are 100% legal.
it just seems to me that the whole topic is a joke especially if you ask anyone who works with other athletes, there's no doubt that a good majority uses performance enhancing drugs. i duno. blah. whatever. watch the movie if you haven't its pretty interesting regardless
Gizzard responding to a
comment by OsnapsonJC
05.26.10 - 5:00 pm
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steroids are regulated as a class a schedule 1 substance in most countries
steroids has a use. its when it falls into the wrong hands that it becomes a problem. performance enhancing has been around almost as long as competitive sports has been around if not longer. Its only in the past 50 years or so we started establishing regulating governing bodies for fair competition.
1 cheat getting caught does not ruin the sport.
@d818, gene therapy carries with it more dangers than benefits, and any athlete resorting to such technology in this day and age must be stupid. you're playing with fuses with no labels on a large scale power grid.
_iJunes responding to a
comment by Gizzard
05.26.10 - 5:15 pm
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Medical/out of competition and performance enhancing use and use are almost mutually exclusive with exceptions.
_iJunes responding to a
comment by Gizzard
05.26.10 - 5:17 pm
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What about steriod use in the amature ranks ?
For Masters its common place known as hormone therapy made available by
most insurance companies to those over 40. From what I have seen anybody who
uses regardless of age usually winds up weaker once off the program.
Dedicated818 responding to a
comment by _iJunes
05.26.10 - 6:20 pm
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Alcohol and steroids cannot be compared ... I understand what you mean but ... its not the same .. Im not denying that people do it ... Im would have to be extremely naive to think anything like that ... I just don't think it should be used because you have young kids start doing it and by the time the get to be a professional they cant perform without it .. its a major part of pro sports and as long as money is being made it will never go away.
OsnapsonJC responding to a
comment by Gizzard
05.26.10 - 6:51 pm
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i dont know if i am i completely wrong..or just slow to catch on... but the more I learn about it ... the top of the competitive cycling community forms such a tight, elite group, not only amongst themselves but with CEO's, businesses and anyone else with any power or control over the cycling industry making it entirely possible for the majority of pro cyclists to be doping. there are many people who are invested in the cyclist's success. racing is their life. the top pro cyclist want to remain on top too many people waiting to take their place..they cant run the risk of some joe nobody coming in and cleaning out because they're doping hell no..more than likley doping in pro cycling has become an unspoken understanding between all the top dogs and they just have to put on the show for the fans and doping enforcements organizations that cycling is seen as a pure sport... when someone reaches that level of skill in anything- best in the world- they shouldnt have to be limited by a bunch of people who, somehow, slid themselves into a position to limit these athletes, people who have no idea how much suffering these guys have put in and how much sweat it took to become one of the best in the world only to have some fat guy tell them what they cant do to their body, their body they obviously know well enough to have gotten to where they are.........the pros run the show......no doubt...the question is how far down does this unspoken acceptance of doping go......maybe john can provide more valid info since he is on the cusp of being in the know....now that I think about it he did have a big packet fall out of his pocket that he said was ketchup right before the marathon crash race...
Jet-son05.26.10 - 7:30 pm
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kind of hard to tell, but click on "Blaze It"
md205.28.10 - 3:12 pm
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