NOTE: All timestamps are in the future because WE are in the future. The care takers of Midnight Ridazz.com reserves the right to remove, edit, move or delete anything for any reason. None of the opinions expressed on these boards represent the Midnight Ridazz nor can anyone purport to speak on behalf of Midnight Ridazz.
The Los Angeles Police Department supports and encourages responsible cycling as well as cyclists’ right to fair and equitable use of the roadways. The Department is also committed to protecting cyclist’s 1st Amendment Right to call attention to issues affecting their community.
In keeping with the Department’s mission, and in response to the cycling community’s calls for police involvement and participation, the LAPD will be present at the next Los Angeles Critical Mass ride scheduled for June 25, 2010.
Critical Mass attracts hundreds, and at times thousands of cyclists. People come together for a variety of reasons: To assert their desire for cleaner air, less congestion, safer roads, more infrastructure, and to celebrate and ride in solidarity with other likeminded individuals.
There are however some that use Critical Mass to mask their illegal and dangerous activities which generate multiple complaints from the community. These activities are counterproductive to the intended goals of Critical Mass. Among the documented incidents of concern are:
Vandalism
Thefts
Assaults
Criminal Threats
Drinking in Public
Smoking/using illicit substances
Driving/Riding under the influence
Running red lights/Stop sign
Crossing the center line or riding against traffic
The Department will support the rights of all persons to peacefully gather and bring attention to their cause.
LAPD officers will be present to ensure the safety of all those who lawfully participate and will take enforcement action against those who violate the law or the vehicle code.
Please remember:
Participants under the age of 18 must wear a helmet
Participants should have necessary lighting equipment
All bikes must have brakes or otherwise comply with the braking requirements
Ride Responsibly, Share the Road. We will see you there!!!
From: DAVID KRUMER <35128@lapd.lacity.org>
Subject: LAPD and Critical Mass
To:glennbaileysfv@yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, June 15, 2010, 5:12 PM
Good Morning All!
Attached is a flyer that we will be releasing at an upcoming press conference. The flyer will also be distributed by officers at the next Critical Mass as folks start to gather.
At the LACBAC meeting on June 2 as well as on numerous blogs we heard calls for more involvement and support. Many of you have also indicated that the majority of the participants are there for a legitimate an lawful purpose...to promote and call attention to cycling issues. The Department agrees and is committed to protecting cyclists 1st Amendment Rights. To that end we will be present at the Critical Mass ride.
The flyer is meant to discourage the attendance of, and put on notice those elements that cause discord. Those engaged in unlawful behavior are not representative of the group. The primary purpose of our presence is not enforcement...however enforcement action will be taken when appropriate.
Feel free to post the flyer on your websites. While some have asked for LAPD to be more involved there are some that may not welcome us. It is our hope that you encourage the cycling community to embrace our presence.
David
Sgt I David Krumer
Office of Operations
Evaluation and Administration Section
213-486-6059
I think its a chance for LAPD to either call CM's bluff or just a new step toward a more bike friendly Los Angeles.
If all the riders do is mess around, then the LAPD and LA City can just say, "we tried to support your rights and cause, but most of you weren't interested in anything other than breaking laws and causing problems".
But if CM/MR is what is has been (70% geeks, 20% reformed knuckleheads, 10% wannabe gangsters), then it should give them no reason to not support CM.
md2 responding to a comment by alicestrong
06.16.10 - 10:18 am
I'll be there. To me it looks like LACM is going to get the positive attention it is seeking by this. This IS a good thing. Don't think of them as enforcement, think of them as escorts. (Which is really needed for large group rides through rush hour traffic)
As long if this is the LAPD showing support, then everything will be great.
"But if CM/MR is what is has been (70% geeks, 20% reformed knuckleheads, 10% wannabe gangsters), then it should give them no reason to not support CM."
I hope you are right.
I have a feeling the ones we would be concerned about will end up riding elsewhere. You think? ...I'm hoping.
i think at this point it's a chance for the leaders (you know what I mean) to show LAPD some support when they really do go after riders who are out of hand.
There will always be grey areas about whether such and such was called for -- but it's about working together. If LAPD is too hardheaded then it won't work and vice versa.
But this is clearly a sign of compromise from the LAPD. And anyone who has had an honest / good relationship knows that compromises are not easy, but they help ensure a better future.
md2 responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.16.10 - 10:45 am
This is either going to be one of the more pleasant and low-key Critical Mass rides in a long time, or there's going to be lots of whining here the following day because law enforcement actually engaged in law enforcement against those riders who didn't read the memo and chose to break the law anyway.
yeah, i think it would be foolish to test their resolve on the first ride, so riders should show up with lights and such.
I'm a bit worried about the brake issue considering the kinds of setup some riders use. Will there be a "my legs are a brake" dispute?
My less cynical side is thinking the police want to do something to right their wrongs, but not mistake their support for weakness or indifference to the law. They have more than bike community to answer to if they start showing this kind of support. It would generate a good degree of criticism from outside the bike community if they ignore implementing certain laws. It may just be tough talk to please some, and a firm warning to the riders who want to test the limits of their support.
Thats my speculation on their motives.
md2 responding to a comment by Alex Thompson
06.16.10 - 11:36 am
I think it's a good flier, it outlines the purpose of the ride and respects the ride. We should stop at red lights and not ride in lanes against traffic. CM has never condoned aggressive behavior, tagging or stealing. Riders who do that are asked to leave the ride.
As far as drinking and smoking, well, it's no biggy, there are plenty of other smaller 'party rides' that are more appropriate for that sort of thing.
With such a huge crowd it's probably best to focus on being safe while having fun to encourage others to ride more.
Thanks for the positivity. It's what we need to make this work.
Before I did Midnight Ridazz, the first group ride I ever did was LA Critical Mass. And it was good. I look forward to seeing it become successful again and be actually effective for the cycling community rather than backfire on it.
As I may quote a friend - "It will just be interesting to see how things unfold, we're sitting
front row to major bike shit going on."
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by Girl Power
06.16.10 - 12:52 pm
Well, I still think corking is better, but if they want us to stop we will stop.
We will be waiting at green lights to let the ride catch up and stay together, this will give the car traffic behind us the full brunt of the wait time, corking and 'running the red lights' evenly distributes the wait time between cars behind us and cars intersecting the ride.
It seems to me that if the LAPD was concerned with good traffic flow they would encourage the entire ride to move, as a whole, as quickly as possible through the streets and it's already been proven that corking and running reds accomplishes this.
i'm repeating myself, but I wanted to put this here:
What if we were to stop at every red light and just let the ride disperse? It will still be a ride, and we will be still demonstrating our rights to ride on the streets. Perhaps it's even a more effective way to show that this is a decent way to commute around town.
I'm open to explore how that will affect the ride as we are part of traffic. As long as we know where we are going people can catch up. This is something to consider deciding at the start of each ride. If we have a destination to get to, we can all ride there in different ways and it will still be a group ride effort. Self reliance and common sense is important in these days and times.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by Girl Power
06.16.10 - 1:22 pm
I'd be very surprised if they don't end up corking for us. After all, they do for more "mainstream" community rides (Pershing Square, Tom LaBonge, etc.)
If LAPD escorts the ride of 500-800 bicycles, it would hit home to the car drivers that bicycles are here, increasing in numbers and they aren't going away.
its pretty smart on there side to release this...they gave a warning so that if what happened last month happens again, "we have been warned".
only sad thing is how many people will still not have proper lights, wanna drink or not have brakes....will we get kicked off our bikes too?
i personally dont ride with brakes and i dont have a problem with it...however it sounds like if the cops are to notice that, they have the right to take what action is necessary to stop me.
The part where it says "or otherwise comply with braking requirements" seems to indicate that they will accept a fixed-gear skid as meeting the requirements. That's the only thing other than a brake that would allow you to "otherwise comply," isn't it?
I'm hoping that any police in attendance get a full briefing on all the subtleties of the bike laws, and that they enforce them fairly.
At least they're not going after people for bike licenses.
Yes, I am assuming there will be escorts at the start of the ride in uniform. Better yet on bikes. They will figure it out. But if they are not. Fuck if I care, I'm just riding my bike.
i'm going to suggest a flyer to convince the ride to come up with a destination and stop at every red light just to show how even more plugged up traffic can be if the huge ride gets chopped up by red lights without corking.
Let them see that we are traffic by acting like traffic.
We may go different ways to the destination, but it will still be a group effort. Bikes all over the place is more effective Critical Mass goal than a parade. Let's pick a destination, announce it and ride to meet there.
This is my suggestion. Please pass it on.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by Alex Thompson
06.16.10 - 2:48 pm
Officer Krumer told me himself he had been to a CM not in uniform.
I don't know if he was on the clock or not.
I think the purpose of this is that uniformed police presence will act as deterrent for the ride to stay "under control". However we should treat every public event that can be construed as a "protest" as a place where undercover police may be present.
trickmilla responding to a comment by Alex Thompson
06.16.10 - 2:50 pm
All the revenue created by the LAPD writing tickets to cyclists will go to paying for Manny's settlement. The LAPD found a way to get back all the money they are losing for the numerous excessive force settlements they are paying out, lol.
X-Large responding to a comment by Alex Thompson
06.16.10 - 2:51 pm
I guess I'm trying to say that we shouldn't have to be afraid of the cops.
If we try riding by the rules in huge numbers and creating lots of traffic legally by BEING TRAFFIC, then maybe the cops might end up becoming more scared of us.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by chunkylover09
06.16.10 - 3:17 pm
in case anybody else missed it i am agreeing whole heartedly to this:
"Let them see that we are traffic by acting like traffic.
We may go different ways to the destination, but it will still be a group effort. Bikes all over the place is more effective Critical Mass goal than a parade. Let's pick a destination, announce it and ride to meet there.
I think it means that Trickmilla cosigned Borfo's post with the backing of 1 million other persons he represents; I think. I'm guessing he got about 10 blocks of Korea Town on his side.
And considering how quickly the bike community is becoming divided, you might want to get started on your army of me's.
md2 responding to a comment by chunkylover09
06.16.10 - 3:29 pm
I don't claim to speak for a million people.
+1,000,000 is just a hyperbolic way of saying that I strongly agree with his suggestion.
On another note. I don't think the bike scene is divided at all.
yes there are a few people who tend to alienate others from themselves, but I don't see it as factional.
For instance AT tried to sabotage The LACBC + MR bike safety poster project, but some of his colleagues at bikeside were participants.
Personally, I don't have anything against anyone. If somebody does something I dont agree with I'll point it out. If they want to debate it I will. If they do something good and it inspires me, I'll give them props.
"If we always gave a lane to cars when they were around, and didn't' ride though uncorked lights, the police may be more inclined to look the other way, although I'm sure that none of them would ever be happy to see us rolling through corked lights.
I love the party, and adding rules for the ride goes against the basic spirit of the night, but if we keep blocking lanes and freeway exits for too long the police will bring it all to a grinding halt, and I would hate that most of all.
But even with 1000 riders, if we obey the traffic laws, I don't think the police will have the right to bust us. I personally don't want to stop at every red light, but sometimes in higher traffic spots, it might be a good idea. I think adding the paragraph about this at the top of the web site is a good move, but maybe a more prominent version would be useful. "
Keeping his wish in mind I was moved to encouraging group rides to follow this advice.
Yes, stopping at every red light is really tough sometimes on group rides. But, think how we can make a statement in itself by acting like the traffic that we are during critical mass. By having the destination known at the start of the ride, people who do end up getting separated from the main group due to red lights will know where to go and get together in the end. It makes Critical Mass more dynamic and interesting.
Let's try this out. This time we have got the police and attention of a lot of people. Encourage everyone to learn and follow all road rules and where the ride is ending up.
Oh, gee, who do I root for in this moral drama? The heavy-handed, wagon-circling frontier policing of the LAPD, or the ham-fisted, alienating, dead end tactic of Critical Mass?
I don't see why we'll need to stop at every red light if LAPD will be on the ride as escorts! Put their asses to stop traffic and let the cyclists through the lights! THEY'RE THERE TO WORK, NOT HAVE A GOOD TIME! But yes I agree, this is a good thing. At least for LACM. But not for other party rides, please! Don't bring them to The Peoples Ride! Lol!
I root for PeeCee.
I don't think LACM is rotten at its core by any means.
I think the core of the principal is a group of people riding together, starting from a certain time and place. The wikipedia gods agree with me
"In fact, the purpose of Critical Mass is not formalized beyond the direct action of meeting at a set location and time and traveling as a group through city or town streets on bikes."
Every ride is better with some PC
I hope you can make it.
I love me some good PC commentary during a police escorted event.
Kinda like when we marched against prop h8.
I agree, the first ride should AIM to do more than just "lets see how this works".
On first glance it looks like we can extend a hand to LAPD, by assuming or giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are helping for good reasons (i.e. good for the bike community).
What can riders do to engage the LAPD on that night?
Suggestion
First Stop: a donut shop? Donuts on us.
Get it? Lets make them feel somewhat welcome, laugh, something.. i dont know.. just show once again that cyclist are not the problem. Look, imagine if they could see CM as a safe ride and imagine they got their kids, etc to do a future ride. Now you have those officers in a real dilemma.
md2 responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.16.10 - 4:30 pm
Good article over at LAist--thanks for that heads up.
What if Critical Mass with LAPD support, as Zach suggests, could "grow...the number of riders" & be "an ad hoc rolling cicLAvia"? I'd be there, I'd bring my wife, my kids, their friends, my friends that are a bit hesitant to ride their bikes, their friends, their kids, their kids' friends, etc. It would be a different CM, sure, but if it can get more people on bikes, then it's got my support. A game changer like that could put LA on the map.
Someone that's ridden SFCM with their PD support (i.e., Roadblock, others)--let us know how that goes.
Could we convince the (dare I say) LACBC to communicate with the LAPD in honor of LACM about proposed ideas to promote safe riding? And, rather than LACM riding as a parade, could we encourage people to stop at lights and ride safely and effectively to get to a certain location? Perhaps places that could be prearranged, discount for donuts for riders, a public speaker or artist to stop at?, Collective ideas are welcome.
I'm just trying to help.
I'm not saying I have all the solutions.
I'd just like to encourage the concept of a predetermined destination and require stops at reds. Any disagreements?
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by trickmilla
06.16.10 - 4:51 pm
I rode CM15 along with a big group of ridazz.
I didn't see any stress with the cops.
I 'spose at some point they were corking for us that ride was way bigger than anything I ever rode in L.A. i'm talking as many as 3 or 4 thousand people. So maybe not a great example as the ride got REALLLY spread out. I think traffic was bing corked for 15-20 minutes at a time mid-ride. Not exactly endearing us to drivers.
trickmilla responding to a comment by dudeonabike
06.16.10 - 4:53 pm
I dig the idea of hitting up donut shops. That's hilarious. And who doesn't love donuts?--the only problem would be swamping the shop. We'd need to hit a donut factory. Anyone know any (other than Krispy Cremes, which suck, IMHO)?
I don't think LACM is rotten at its core by any means.
I think the core of the principal is a group of people riding together, starting from a certain time and place.
And that's the problem. It never should have been a group of people riding together. Critical Mass marginalized itself from the beginning by trying to use a large group activity to showcase, and assert the rights of, an essentially individual activity.
The idea, of course, was to artificially inflate the number of cyclists on the road in a particular area during a particular window of time. So far so good, but the founders would have done much better to create a way to put all of these cyclists into the area without clumping them into a big mob. The group is what killed it. What kills it. I really believe that it's irredeemable as long as the group model is in place. That's why I think it's time for a new tactic.
PC responding to a comment by trickmilla
06.16.10 - 4:58 pm
Maybe the concept of 1000 bikes getting donuts is lame, but the point is to decide a destination to ride to as a break. We could then ride back to the start point, or another agreed destination. We could have people shout out locations and then flip for it.
Sorry, I'm not interested in The People's ride.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by dudeonabike
06.16.10 - 5:01 pm
I think the essence is not a "mob" but enough people riding at the same time that it simulated what naturally happens in naturally bike dominated cities. That bikes group up together so they can take the right of way.
Corking is more of a tradition not really the essence of what CM is.
As far as I'm concerned a "critical manners" ride is just a critical mass ride with a different flavor and attitude. The essence is still there.
But then again, the owner of House of Spirits had to cancel his yacht order once the echo/sunset meeting point changed. Pioneer Chicken just lacked the vision
md2 responding to a comment by dudeonabike
06.16.10 - 5:09 pm
I get what you're saying and i think it's a good point. One thing I'm not clear on for critical convergence is how it is really different from something like the xmas ride.
It's hard to agree that the group kills it, because its the mass group that usually impacts participants so much. There is something really amazing about 1000 red blinking lights at night, especially on those nice occasions where the route goes over a bridge and you're lucky person who didn't mash up front. instead you sat back and watch the show 3/4 behind. Those are some great moments; they'll do something to a jaded dude like me.
md2 responding to a comment by PC
06.16.10 - 5:16 pm
I think this is the best solution by far. I tried suggesting this to the SMCM group but it fell on def ears. Not to digress but is scmcm still around? By following the laws the group of 500 splits into 10 autonomous groups of 50ish... It becomes a "hide n seek" situation where groups are roaming in search of each other, riding legally, and waaaaaaay more of a traffic nightmare. Plus, by splitting it up it will confuse and split up the cops.
However, I don't think the cops are going to ticket for ridig as a parade. I think they are going to be cool about it. They will probably draw from the way sfpd handles cm.
@323 good point. If the cops come along it will be a signal to drivers that bikes are legit.
Roadblock responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.16.10 - 5:17 pm
Joe, I coordinated something like that months ago, called the Non-ride. We all rode around town taking different routes to get to the same destination. We took the lane everywhere (small groups) and obeyed traffic laws. Would love to do it again.
"What if we were to stop at every red light and just let the ride disperse? "
I think that would diminish the impact of the ride, the point is to encourage others to cycle and join a fun, traveling party.
But the second, and more important reason is safety. There is more potential for accident if you have car cutting into the middle of the ride. So it's far more dangerous to split the ride, you don't want cyclists, cars, cyclists, cars, cyclists etc all trying to negotiate moves around the other.
Corking and running the red lights is *the* fastest and safest way to move a huge ride through traffic.
The second best alternative is for the front of the ride to ride slow and not separate from the rest of the pack, and for everyone to wait for the entire ride to catch up and all go on the green at the same time.
I think the essence is not a "mob" but enough people riding at the same time that it simulated what naturally happens in naturally bike dominated cities. That bikes group up together so they can take the right of way.
Yes--cities in the developing world where anarchy prevails on the road to begin with, and cyclists have difficulty getting through intersections because nobody stops for them. Why anybody thought this was a good idea HERE, where all a cyclist has to do to get across an intersection is wait for the light, will eternally be a mystery to me. The group model is of no use whatsoever when it comes to the issues that vex cyclists on these streets.
PC responding to a comment by trickmilla
06.16.10 - 5:28 pm
If all goes well, LA Critical Mass could be transformed into LA Ciclovia. Similar to how the bootleggers went from criminals to successful and respected business people overnight, when alcohol became legal and regulated.
Every month riding legally, with LAPD corking. Families, couples, people on dates, and singles looking for a date, could all participate in a monthly bike ride without fear of angry car drivers, dangerous cross traffic at intersections or other safety issues. Everyone riding on the street, sanctioned and protected by LAPD. This was the solution to the LA Critical Mass ride. It should have happened a long time ago. It took hundreds and hundreds of LA bicyclists riding Critical Mass every month to make this finally happen.
I agree with you, I believe LAPD is already reviewing the SF Critical Mass rides and will probably use that as a model.
It may be too early to try to implement the idea for June 25 LACM
This is not MY idea. It's all of ours. I just find it very interesting and would love to implement it on group rides - PARTICULARLY LACM.
However, I would encourage you all to consider the idea.
The intent is not to disperse the ride, but to have all riders following road rules and creating an experimental medium that demonstrates what this city would be more like if everybody chose the bike over the car for transportation. It may be more effective in making positive impacts about cycling in the process. Everyone still rides towards the same place and this can be repeated.
Perhaps It may not be suitable for LACM. Parade through with the cops, that's fine. I hope it works out, and I will be there.
I still want to see this though. I have been suggested by mentors that it could be called Los Angeles Meet Experiment.
get it?
Good night and see you at the next ride.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by Roadblock
06.16.10 - 5:38 pm
MR and LACM are not one and the same and I think this will help establish those differences. It's ok to ride for a cause, as well as ride to hang out with your friends, let's just enjoy each for what they are. Please do your best to prepare yourselves beforehand to avoid any confrontations with the boys in blue. I'm so looking forward to this.
In disucssing this development with other bike people, I've had concerns expressed to me that LAPD's presence will not go well--it's just the "nature of CM." I don't necessarily share this person's views and certainly can't corroborate the facts, but I put it out there in the hope we avoid the negative situation that happened in SF when SFPD joined the ride. I'd like to say that LAPD's current attitude is different, but I that's really unknown.
He informed that the Police rode with CM in SF years ago and it didn’t go well. Ultimately the Police freaked out when the riders got sick of being told where to ride and being assigned a specific route. The riders starting taking off in multiple directions and “disobeying” the Police’s authority. That’s when the Police starting cracking heads and pinning people to the ground. Multiple arrests were made, all of them were dismissed eventually.
LACM can wait at the green lights for the entire ride to catch up - it seems very odd to me to have hundreds of riders waiting on the roadside, but, if that is what the LAPD wants then we should do it.
I think they are back tracking, trying to save face for the way officers attacked cyclists running red lights, when they come to their senses they will realize that corking and running the red lights is the fastest and safest way to move a large ride through the city.
LACM is a time-honored Los Angeles community strengthening tradition, it makes the city a better place and people (cyclists, cars, pedestrians, and business owners) look forward to it and give plenty of support.
Girl Power responding to a comment by dudeonabike
06.16.10 - 5:51 pm
"Author: ubrayj02
Comment:
I feel that my experience the past 4 years leading scores of rides - Borfo's got it right.
You need a destination, a mega phone to let people know what's up, and then let the ride commence. Stoppoing at stop signs is absurd, but stop lights are no big deal.
A loose group of riders can make this work on the fly. It will turn every street into bike street, and it will allow so much more than parading around in one chaotic mass will allow."
The intersection just 50 feet from my hous is a night mare.
Just 45 mins ago I had to ride make a right and bust a U on hollywood because riding straight across this time of day is suicidal.
I know you live in the cushy environs of San Pedro but have you not experienced the the hectic and yes often chaotic traffic conditions of Metropolitan Los Angeles?
But I digress.
Are you saying that you thing ALL GROUP RIDES are pointless?
Thats what I am getting from your post.
I mean we can debate it.
I would be absolutely shocked if you are unfamiliar with the experience of feeling safer and more comfortable on the road when riding with 6+ people and taking the lane.
I know you are free thinker ... but you usually have a some what of of a grounding in reality for your unique thought patterns.
As I see it, the events that transpired during the last critical mass was a major call for a change in tatics. Now that our cause have been recognized by the masses shouldn't we set out not to force our opinions on the folks riding by in their petro powered automobiles. Instead I say that we stray away from the status quo and move to have them understand the movement that is taking place in this beautiful city that all of us call home. In any major event that has caused conflict the message always stayed the same, but the means has always changed with the times. How long do we expect local authorities to put up with our confrontational ways? I can tell you that it wouldn't be long. This is a major stepping stone and we should accept as a turning point. There maybe a few that are skeptical of the L.A.P.D. motives and they are right in doing so given past experiences and their overall outlook of what goes on in the communities that they live in. Let's take this as an opportunity to further our cause and not an excuse to fuck up for what all of us have worked towards for so long. Next CM I say obey all traffic laws because this time we will have a greater audience. If you are one of the ones who rides dirty, by that I mean without the proper lighting, no helmet and you're underage, or if you drink and smoke weed on the rides. Take care of that before coming out, you have plenty of time to get things in order between now and then. I'm all for the presence of L.A.P.D. on the ride. Hopefully they will weed out all of the bad elements that misrepresents riders.
Apart from my existing dislike of their policies unrelated to the matter at hand, it would be a cool thing to witness how this spectacle all goes down.
We need video, pictures and other stories to follow in order to see how everything went.
Perhaps I'm just quixotically hoping to see LACM transform into something more beneficial rather than hurt the image of cycling. But If I can somehow effect it to lose that tarnish it currently holds then I'm going to try as much as I can. I hope to get everyone on the same page regarding this. Pipe dreams? Waste of time? I don't think so. This is our cycling community. I've seen a lot of changes take place. I'm going to continue being positive and I hope you will too. I'll see you all there with flyers and a Ban iJunes picket sign.
@dudeonabike maybe a long time ago things didn't go well with SFCM and the cops but nowadays it's just a big ole parade. It goes in random directions except that the cops make sure it doesn't go on the freeway lol.
I'm definitely going to be on the next LACM. I suggest we immediately try the legal riding and planned destination idea. It's going to be bonkers. Riding legally is going to hurt some peoples brains but the end result will be beautiful. I'm down to address the group and explain the concept if no one else wants to. All the CM purists will be up in arms of course but this is some higher level "civil obedience" type shit.
Isn't there also a law about riding two abreast on streets? Because if they enforced that, then it would be the lonnngggesssttt straight line of cyclists ever.
No, but I've noticed that people sometimes accuse me of that when I'm rude enough to apply critical thinking to their sacred cows.
Just 45 mins ago I had to ride make a right and bust a U on hollywood because riding straight across this time of day is suicidal.
Really? You were at a four-way controlled intersection with the green light in your favor and couldn't get through because the cars on Hollywood kept blowing their red? Funny, I probably ride in Hollywood almost as often as you do and I've never experienced this.
I've had trouble getting across a busy street from a side street or alley when I have a stop sign and they don't have any sign or light to stop them, but that happens to me when I'm driving as well--and somehow I don't get the urge to find 500 other drivers to help me bully my way across.
I know you live in the cushy environs of San Pedro
Yeah, because it's not like we have four- and six-lane arterial roads in San Pedro. Nor do we have constant truck traffic down here in this harbor area abutting one of the largest seaport complexes on the planet (in which I happen to work, and commute by bicycle).
And yet, even living in this bucolic, traffic-free slice of arcadia that is the Port of Los Angeles, I am somehow able to distinguish between a problem facing third-world cyclists (the literal inability of lone cyclists to traverse intersections in large cities where traffic signals are nonexistent or ignored) and the problems that vex cyclists in the US (dooring, right and left hooks, trying to get to the left lane with cars whizzing by at high speed, etc.) and to wonder why on earth people assume that a tactic designed for the former problem must somehow be useful against any of the latter. Go figure.
Are you saying that you thing ALL GROUP RIDES are pointless?
For about the fourth time, no. ALL GROUP RIDES do not claim to be upholding cyclists' rights or educating bystanders and drivers about cycling as a form of transportation.
Thats what I am getting from your post.
Did you also get it from this post a few weeks ago, in which I specifically pointed out the difference in aims between a social group ride (MR) and Critical Mass?
"But my point is that MR isn't primarily there as an advocacy or advancement tool (no matter how fervently some people like to fantasize about it being so), and can't be held to the same standard." -- PC, 06.2.10 - 1:54 pm
I would be absolutely shocked if you are unfamiliar with the experience of feeling safer and more comfortable on the road when riding with 6+ people and taking the lane.
Then I guess you'd better get a defibrillator, because you're about to get shocked.
I don't feel any safer taking a lane with people than without. I don't feel significantly less safe, unless I have the misfortune to be riding with idiots who don't know how to ride in a group, but being with other cyclists and taking a lane just because we can doesn't make me feel safer. After all, if I need to take a lane I take it, regardless of how many people are with me. And at least when I'm by myself, the only cyclist who can fuck up and get me hurt is me.
I know you are free thinker ... but you usually have a some what of of a grounding in reality for your unique thought patterns.
Reality, eh? You mean that place where the usefulness of an action is measured by its tangible results, rather than by what the people taking the action wish were its results? I've been known to take it into account. Thanks for noticing.
PC responding to a comment by trickmilla
06.17.10 - 3:28 am
I thought I would never go back to LACM, but I'm definitely going to go to this one. Borfo's arguments are WAY solid, as well as a few others.
I also think it would be in our best interests to try to really suggest to all the ridazz that we know on a personal basis (those who may/may not read the forum) who attempted to distance themselves from LACM to represent riding in this city for what it REALLY is.
The more GREAT RIDING we get on this LACM....well, the more great ridazz people will see.
And as far as corking, etc etc- we gotta play it by ear and not be too paranoid. If we want anything outta this city, we gotta make nice and cooperate, like in kindergarten, be smiles and friendly (and try to mean it!), and hopefully we will get a similar response. If we go into it negative....we definitely won't get any pleasant surprises.
It's so on. As you say, "[i]t's going to be bonkers"--in a good way.
Here's to the next phase of LA Critical Mass in the making! I'm thinking broader reach, larger age groups and demographics represented, families, kids, etc.
Two rules. Obey ALL traffic laws, and get to the destination point in 45 minutes any which way you please. The rest is bicycle bliss. 700 riders filling the streets everywhere for blocks and blocks in all directions.
Roadblock responding to a comment by dudeonabike
06.17.10 - 9:45 am
whoa... this might be a huge surprised to the LAPD.
I imagine they're looking for one large group to escort. Changing the game in this way might look like we're trying to confuse THEM, not just implement new tactics for educating and demonstrating.
What do you think?
md2 responding to a comment by Roadblock
06.17.10 - 10:41 am
This might be the largest LA Critical Mass ever. I am not sure LAPD is prepared or equipped to escort or follow 1000 bicyclists. I hope the media reports on this event. It will shake the very foundation of the LA Car culture.
I've never been on a huge group ride like CM cos I'm a slow rider but my brother keeps telling me that it's a good ride to start with. So I'm definitely going to this month's. Having the LAPD there makes me feel more comfortable cos it seems more like a partnership and that they are there with the riders. Not there to harass riders and "police" them. So I'm pretty excited to take part!
Those who want to follow the LAPD in a parade are welcome to. The only requirement is to obey all traffic laws towards the destination. This will be announced and cooperatively decided at the start. There's nothing wrong with what we are planning to do.
The only thing wrong that could happen is douchebags at the start might try to antagonize the cops. Let's hope that's not the case.
I did imagine it was wrong, I just wondered if it would be perceived by the LAPD in a bad way. But maybe that doesn't matter. Either way, i'm more excited something new is happening
md2 responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.17.10 - 11:14 am
Agreed. I actually think it's awesome that the lapd will be there and escorting like others say that is HUGE but I just hope they aren't expecting to ticket people for trying to keep the group together. I haven't had a chance to read their PowerPoint on how they are going to treat the ride. I probably should.
There's nothing we can do about changing their perception of us.
We can change our own perceptions of who we are. That's usually more effective.
They will know that we are going to be stopping at all reds. If they do cork for us I am sure people are going to feel comfortable riding through them. That doesn't mean we have to ride that way.
We are riding our bikes as traffic. WE ARE TRAFFIC. Traffic isn't inherently bad - It is what it is. That is what Critical Mass means to me. Having fun, asserting rights, encouraging cycling are all by products - but it's not the definition of what CM is.
well, the literal definition of Critical Mass is : 1. point of change: a point or situation at which change occurs.
I am of course referring to the bicycle ride that was given this title in SF of 92. The literal definition does have a significance. The change that occurs is a reaction of our convergence.
Critical Mass is a bike ride plain and simple. The ride takes place on the Last Friday Of Every Month (in Chicago anyway). A Critical Mass is created when the group of riders comes together for those few hours to take back the streets of our city. The right of the people to assemble is guaranteed in the Constitution, and Critical Mass helps people remember that right. The Mass itself has no political agenda, though, no more than the people of any other community do. Critical Mass is open to all, and it welcomes all riders to join in a celebration of riding bicycles. Why? Because bikes are fun!
Sure, as with any community, you'll see people of all types. Some people see Critical Mass as a forum for grassroots political change. Some people see it as a protest against cars. Some people just like to ride. The Mass, however, is just that...a bunch of bike riders. You can drive a car the whole month and ride in the Mass. You can be an anarchist and ride in the Mass. The point of the Mass is the Mass, nothing more. Critical Mass has no leadership. It is a ride where no one is in charge. At any time, riders are free to leave, stay, stop, or even help out. Everyone is responsible for themselves and the Mass. Learn how to get involved!
Once you realize that, you're free to enjoy the exhilaration that is a large bike ride. It's quite a sight to be parading down Michigan Avenue with thousands of fellow riders, wishing pedestrians and drivers a "Happy Friday!"
Chicago Critical Mass is a community, yet it's also part of a worldwide Critical Mass community as a whole. Critical Mass rides take place all over the world each month, and Chicago is proud to join in to proclaim our love of bicycles. If you love bikes, and you want to show others how you feel about cycling, come join us!
For more information on the origins of Critical Mass, please see the excellent Wikipedia page on the subject.
I've been on this ride, and CCM does it right! It's always good idea to follow a solid example.
I'm not so goo with words. Are any of you interested in creating 1/4 sheet flyer that describes and inspires all riders to follow the advice of the "Know the destination, stop at all reds lights" idea? I will gladly print out and cut these flyers if you email them to me. Let's make it a group effort. I'm not trying to be a leader, I'm just a supporter like you who is using his own common sense towards making this bike ride the best it can be.
Obey all laws.
The LAPD is here to support bicycles and
ride their own bicycles in solidarity with the mass.
Make your way to the next stop anyway you choose.
Roadblock responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.17.10 - 12:28 pm
Chicago's idea for Critical Mass is TOTAL BULLSHIT and defeats the purpose and reasoning behind Critcal Mass. I'm tired of the idea of making Critical Mass a socially accepted and fun Bike Ride, THAT IS NOT WHAT IT IS ABOUT. WE HAVE A MILLION SOCIAL AND FUN RIDES POSTED ON THE RIGHT =>>>
The FIGHT for bicycle rights and advocacy in Los Angeles is FAR FROM OVER. People are still being assaulted verbally & physically every day. Until that STOPS BEING THE NORM (like it is in actual bicycle friendly cities) awareness and education must continue.
You don't have to agree with the original tenets or tactics of Critical Mass, and you sure as HELL don't have to RIDE it (I don't!) but trying to make it a FAMILY FRIENDLY, SOCIAL FUN RIDE IN THE CITY is THE WRONG THING TO DO.
Critical Mass IS about IN YOUR FACE, DISRUPTIVE and ATTENTION GETTING direct action. You might feel like it's counter-productive, but that's your left-wing, tooth-less liberal brainwashed thinking going on. It might not be for you because it's not for everyone, period. Don't do it! And let the people that know what they're doing, continue it.
The problem that we ALL AGREE ON, is that LACM has been taken over by a bunch of fixie-kiddies, tagger/thugs and hipsters - that don't know what they're doing. They act like their ENTITLED to the road, in the same way they feel entitled to everything - That's the BULLSHIT mentality that's fucking it all up. GO ON A FUCKING SOCIAL RIDE AND ACT LIKE IDIOTS, OH you already do that too. The reason I stopped going on LACM had nothing to do with the Pigs or dealing with angry motorists, it had everything to do with a bunch of fucking idiots kicking cars for NO REASON, who can't fucking ride in a a straight line and think stealing from local mom and pop-shops is OK. It's fucking bullshit and makes me mad. The bike scene in LA was so nice at one time, it was full of a bunch of nerdy misfits, bicycle geeks and generally pleasant people - actually it STILL IS, but most of those people have moved on to being on a bike as a way of life not some fucking hipster bullshit scene.
My intention of getting 1000 bikes to stop at all red lights has nothing to do with - "FAMILY FRIENDLY, SOCIAL FUN RIDE IN THE CITY". My intention is to cause even more traffic in a legal manner, but maybe that point is missed in my explanation.
Civil Disobedience has to do with right and obligation to follow your conscience. (in the Thoreau sense of the term.)
Critical Mass has to do with riding your bike on the road with other people as traffic. (hopefully while following the rules of the road)
They are both totally different things. (but that doesn't mean they don't happen together.)
Demonstrating your rights is a given by just riding your bike. That is a given. There's nothing else needed. So it's kind of irrelevent in the definition of CM to me.
It is a bike ride that meets at a given time.
dot edu
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by the reverend dak
06.17.10 - 12:49 pm
i think the key point here is that the problem-makers are children.
if you don't have the balls to tell kids to behave under threat of public spanking; if you can't BE an authority to enforce civil order, then your whole theory of anarchy and collective action is bullshit.
let the bike police police the bikes. just don't send in the SWAT because someone is in the #1 lane.
Critical Mass IS about IN YOUR FACE, DISRUPTIVE and ATTENTION GETTING direct action.
Can it not still be this, fun and family friendly? I didn't know it they were mutual exclusive.
I still think most of the ideas mentioned (namely Borfo's) on this thread would be perceived as:
IN YOUR FACE
DISRUPTIVE
ATTENTION GETTING
I feel as if the above comments are suppose to suggest CM is a hostile environment. Does it have to be hostile? Maybe I'm with PC then; I'm going to find a fence to sit on.
md2 responding to a comment by the reverend dak
06.17.10 - 1:58 pm
I'm with you 100% Borfo. I will be there promoting this idea. In fact, we won't even have to promote it, we will have to do it or get tickets. I predict by the end of the night The LAPD will be corking for us.
Roadblock responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.17.10 - 2:53 pm
I'm going to suggest NOT printing too many paper flyers.
Not that spoke cards are better for the environment, but I plan on making a bunch of spoke cards with your words, RB. There's less chance of people throwing them away and they have multiple purposes.
I can print them. Let me know if anyone wants to help me laminate them and stuff before the 24th. Perhaps if there are other words to put on it, let me know soon.
I would be happy to help you laminate cards for Project Civil Obedience, or whatever it's called. Just let me know when/where. Working Saturday, but otherwise available...
Speaking of Critical Mass and horns and bagging on Alex Thompson, there was this one time like 5 years ago when AT brought one of those things to LACM. Halfway through the ride, rev106 grabbed it from him and threw it over a fence into a yard full of dogs (at least, I think it was a yard full of dogs - something like that). But in any case, that was the last anyone saw of the horn. Now Thompson's got a blog. No one is going to grab that blog from him and throw it into a yard full of dogs. Never again. Never again.
Your ideas are solid. And it NEVER hurts to try. Think of all the groups in history who had radically different members who made a difference...The Beats, Transcendentalists, the early Feminist Movement...No one has to change their ideas around about what CM *is* just to GIVE IT A SHOT.
sinaphile responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.17.10 - 3:18 pm
Tthanks. It's actually not original an idea. It's been tried many times in CM, but the only reason why it seems to fail is because it doesn't have a very exciting title .. "Critical Manners?" Meh. sounds boring.... People just don't realize how EFFECTIVE it can be though.
Either way, I'm excited to see us do it.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by sinaphile
06.17.10 - 3:31 pm
Sorry that I hit REPLY under your name, BORFO, and not REPLY in general. Your reply button what the first one I saw. you are NOT TOOTHLESS, I can see why you took it personally, YOU BORFO (have to spell it out, to be clear.) are probably one of the only things GOOD going for it right now.
I want to see your idea WORK! Dammit.
And, md2, I didn't imply that it can't be FUN (riding bikes is fun) or SOCIAL (for everyone) i thought it goes without saying. I was emphasizing that it is a DIRECT ACTION first, and foremost.
Whatever, I'm tired of this debate. I have no intent on helping fix it. I only spoke up because I see a lot of misconceptions of what it is, what it can be, and why or why LAPD's participation is misguided.
I have no intention on being someone's DADDY figure, especially a bunch of spoiled hipster brats and wanna-be gangsters. Most of them are bigger than me, and there are more of them, so I sure as hell ain't going to get into a physical fight with some irrational brat and I SURE AS SHIT ain't going to confront a FUCKING DONUT SMEARED PIG in defense of one of these rug-rats.
I'll be out of town that Friday anyway, I HOPE to ride CM in the town I'm going to be in.
"For about the fourth time, no. ALL GROUP RIDES do not claim to be upholding cyclists' rights or educating bystanders and drivers about cycling as a form of transportation."
What are you using as a reference to this view? Are you making this judgment on your own? If you are, then I feel you're propping up these "sacred cows" you referenced earlier. My reference btw comes from wiki. It doesn't state anywhere, at least from the participants, that this is a ride that upholds cyclists' rights, or to educate drivers.
Fuck. After the Lakers game i'm beginning to doubt myself.
I'm trying to avoid LACM becoming what NYCM has become.
If you don't know what I'm talking about see
"Still We Ride"
I doubt things will get this bad. I think this can be completely avoided if we get everyone on board to question the directions on how we do LACM.
However, after seeing wannabe gangster douchebags burning cars and taunting the police downtown, I'm not sure if we will ever see a promise for the future of CM.
I'm gonna need some help to maintain a positive view on this.
Do you think this is a tell tale sign that LACM with an LAPD presence is doomed to fail? Fail in the sense of a portion of the mass will just end up taunting the police, provoke arrests, and cause us to have a situation like NYCM has in which we will require a parade license for every ride?
I hope I'm wrong. Could encouraging project "civil obedience" be the solution?
fuck ... I feel like I'm talking to myself. ( I'm not obsessed.This just feels important to me.)
Borfo you aren't being fair. The laker riots are a result of knucklehead jocks getting drunk and beligerent. These types of people are not on our rides. Compared to a laker riot, LACM will seem docile and boring to the cops.
The kids that come out for LACM might be unruly but they sure aren't beer gut bullying knucklheads out to destroy everything,
Roadblock responding to a comment by Joe Borfo
06.18.10 - 9:27 am
I respectfully disagree. On a few accounts. (except for the part about writing for chickenhead ... DUET!)
Please tell me anywhere in the stated philosophy of CM where monkey wrenching or as you put "IN YOUR FACE, DISRUPTIVE and ATTENTION GETTING direct action" is core to its organizing principal.
Yes, at times that has been the MO of people doing CM, but where in their core philosophy is it stated that the tone of critical mass should be as you describe.
The core of Critical Mass is cyclists meeting at a time and place every month to ride bikes on city streets. Nothing more. It is up to the people who show up at critical mass to decide what the direction and flavor of it will be.
I personally think that Critical Mass tends to attract more people who are interested in disruptiveness because that is that is the way it has often been portrayed by the media.
And perhaps, for people that people that consider that a good monthly, yearly, ongoing political, tactic there is no other outlet for them.
The WTO protests of 1999 had a particular effect on those meetings and raised a great deal of awareness about the WTO. Subsequent attempts at that strategy have been much less sucessful.
No surprise, that was 11 years ago. We must evolve and change our tactics with time.
You don't have to dress in black on black to be subversive. In fact if the cops are expecting black on black a suit and tie might be a more subversive approach.
I think that the brilliance of critical mass, is that its perimeters are very simple.
That people all over the world can adapt is simple methodology to their needs.
And most importantly that the ride can evolve with the times to adapt to a changing environment.
A time, a place, a bike ride & no established hierarchy.
It really is as simple as that.
trickmilla responding to a comment by the reverend dak
06.18.10 - 9:57 am
i think you're on to something there. odds are, if we stop for all the lights, it will create a greater spectacle than if we were running the lights. if the police decide to start corking intersections for us, drivers will get the message that LAPD supports bikes.
It's okay. I'm not playing the game anymore. If you're not him, then my mistake. Please introduce yourself to me later if you are not Allan. I look forward to discussing this with you in person at LACM.
Joe Borfo responding to a comment by fixie4life
06.18.10 - 12:40 pm
(not that anyone gives two shits here, but here we go.)
There is also the issue that there will be a contingent of a number of participants who go to CM just cause trouble and get away with being reckless. Some of you who have been going on LACM in the last few years are probably already aware of this fact. The police presence at the start may shy some of those kids away. The consensual implementation of "Project Civil Obedience" might also help to weed out those who are there to break laws, or at least it may help encourage them to stay in check.
As we well know, the situation with CM and the police is two sided:
1. LAPD need to develop a relationship with CM and be less confrontational and supportive.
2. Cyclists who are just there for mayhem need to be taught to be respectful and of mindful of their own actions.
I think we can effect a positive change for the future of CM if we agree to do it together. I also believe that there really aren't many other choices for us, unless we want to see LACM become like NYCM has become today with permits, abusive police, many arrests, and negative media attention.
Thanks for taking time to read this and to consider using these ideas together.
I say do your xerocracy , do the version of cm you are advocating. Let the people who have other ideas do ther own thing. You'll never get a consensus, and you don't need one. Critical Mass is a time and a place for a bike ride. Do your ride and let's see what happens.
I believe that anyone who supports the idea of a police controlled... umm, I mean supported LACM should be out in force to attend and support this ride. I will, however, choose to do something fun that evening instead.
-->
Ridazz Roulette!
the email attachment. just learned how to convert from powerpoint to pdf to jpeg.
So should I not be waving a big black flag on the ride? That's not the issue here, is it? ...
Borfo +1,000,000
in case anybody else missed it i am agreeing whole heartedly to this:
?
hehe
.
Keep tooting your horn I support you 100%. Keep up the good work....
I'm going to suggest NOT printing too many paper flyers.
Speaking of Critical Mass and horns and bagging on Alex Thompson, there was this one time like 5 years ago when AT brought one of those things to LACM. Halfway through the ride, rev106 grabbed it from him and threw it over a fence into a yard full of dogs (at least, I think it was a yard full of dogs - something like that). But in any case, that was the last anyone saw of the horn. Now Thompson's got a blog. No one is going to grab that blog from him and throw it into a yard full of dogs. Never again. Never again. 
Brother Dak,
(not that anyone gives two shits here, but here we go.)
